Why is Jimmy editing Epstein's page

Vigilant · Unread post by **Vigilant** » Thu Jul 11, 2019 4:07 am

https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?ti ... =905485454

Moral Hazard · Unread post by **Moral Hazard** » Thu Jul 11, 2019 11:55 am

Jimmy Wales / Jimbo Wales provided an Associated Press News (A.P. News) reference for a claim in a Fox News piece.
https://www.apnews.com/3d0490c6774048dc8a5f4fe80d0cf71f

Unread post by **tarantino** » Thu Jul 11, 2019 3:31 pm

Vigilant wrote:https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?ti ... =905485454

Because Jimmy's conservative twitter friends are complaining Epstein's bio overemphasizes his ties to Trump and deemphasizes his ties to Clinton.

Poetlister · Unread post by **Poetlister** » Thu Jul 11, 2019 3:32 pm

The next editor of that article was Sandstein (T-C-L). It's currently a very high profile topic so there's no surprise if well-known people edit it. Were there any obviously POV or whitewashing edits from these people, it would be worth noting.

Poetlister · Unread post by **Poetlister** » Thu Jul 11, 2019 3:34 pm

tarantino wrote:Because Jimmy's conservative twitter friends are complaining Epstein's bio overemphasizes his ties to Trump and deemphasizes his ties to Clinton.

Jimbo's versatile. There have been complaints that he's a Blairite. Now we hear that he favours Trump over Clinton!

Unread post by **tarantino** » Thu Jul 11, 2019 4:03 pm

Next up for Jimmy is Mark Levin (T-H-L).

https://twitter.com/marklevinshow/statu ... 0582649857

Mark Levin wrote:Why is Wikipedia only quoting from a few leftwing, negative attacks on my book and ignoring all the positive reviews?

There are 1800 replies to that tweet, many from people who also have bios on enwiki.

Jimmy wrote:Can you send me a couple of links to high quality third party reliable sources that you'd like to see quoted?

It should come as no surprise that his bio reads the way it does is because of the efforts of Snooganssnoogans.

Randy from Boise · Unread post by **Randy from Boise** » Thu Jul 11, 2019 4:42 pm

Moral Hazard wrote:Jimmy Wales / Jimbo Wales provided an Associated Press News (A.P. News) reference for a claim in a Fox News piece.
https://www.apnews.com/3d0490c6774048dc8a5f4fe80d0cf71f

I just checked and this is the only edit he has ever done to the piece. Nothing to see here...

RfB

Guido den Broeder · Unread post by **Guido den Broeder** » Thu Jul 11, 2019 5:38 pm

Vigilant wrote:https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?ti ... =905485454

Makes me wonder if Wales was one of those friends, or aspired to be one.

Katnips · Unread post by **Katnips** » Thu Jul 11, 2019 6:02 pm

tarantino wrote:Next up for Jimmy is Mark Levin (T-H-L).

https://twitter.com/marklevinshow/statu ... 0582649857

Mark Levin wrote:Why is Wikipedia only quoting from a few leftwing, negative attacks on my book and ignoring all the positive reviews?
There are 1800 replies to that tweet, many from people who also have bios on enwiki.

Jimmy wrote:Can you send me a couple of links to high quality third party reliable sources that you'd like to see quoted?
It should come as no surprise that his bio reads the way it does is because of the efforts of Snooganssnoogans.

Yeah, Snooganssnoogans has been on a particular bender of late. I'm not sure what his goal is...does he think the type of people who listen to conservative talk radio are fact-checking what they hear by reading Wikipedia articles? LOL. He has a major battleground mindset and is getting increasingly bitter about any content dispute that he "loses" (see the section on his user page titled "Content that needs to be in Wikipedia but isn't." ) If you go about editing Wikipedia with the mindset that anything that doesn't go your way is a loss, you're going to burn out pretty quickly. Unless you're getting paid, and then, well.

Poetlister · Unread post by **Poetlister** » Thu Jul 11, 2019 8:37 pm

This is the problem with BLPs on Wikipedia. Many if not most BLPs of prominent people are affected by the house POV, which is generally left of centre.

Guido den Broeder · Unread post by **Guido den Broeder** » Thu Jul 11, 2019 9:18 pm

Poetlister wrote:This is the problem with BLPs on Wikipedia. Many if not most BLPs of prominent people are affected by the house POV, which is generally left of centre.

Keep in mind that what in the US counts as 'left of centre', is considered 'slightly less to the far right' in other parts of the world.

Katnips · Unread post by **Katnips** » Thu Jul 11, 2019 9:36 pm

Guido den Broeder wrote:
Poetlister wrote:This is the problem with BLPs on Wikipedia. Many if not most BLPs of prominent people are affected by the house POV, which is generally left of centre.
Keep in mind that what in the US counts as 'left of centre', is considered 'slightly less to the far right' in other parts of the world.

This is definitely true. The problem with Snoog isn't a left vs. right thing. It's a partisan thing, D vs. R. He's aggressively defensive of the modern (establishment) version of the U.S. Democratic Party. For instance, he thinks he's making himself look ecumenical by being an attack dog on Tulsi Gabbard's page, but yeah....no one who's anyone in the Democratic Party gives two licks about her (she's at Marianne Williamson's level, basically) so it's an easy way for him to score points and say "hey, I put negative content on Democratic pages, too!" Yeah, ones that don't matter. And for some reason the deeply grandfathered-in admin Neutrality goes around cleaning up Snoog's messes for him and no one seems to notice/care. On many political issues I certainly agree with Snoog, but I've come to deeply resent what a bully he is. His strategy is basically to be an insufferable asshole and to continualy raise the costs of anyone who disagrees with him. Most (sane) people give up, leaving him to effectively take ownership over whatever articles he likes. Whatever one's politics, this isn't a healthy dynamic for Wikipedia. And it has made me quite suspicious that he's being paid, because what kind of volunteer would be so extremely dogged in such an icky, toxic environment. I stopped editing years ago but still have to hate watch my favorite show, ha.

Bezdomni · Unread post by **Bezdomni** » Thu Jul 11, 2019 10:08 pm

Snoog oddly seems to be always seeking fame. I think he's hoping for extensive coverage from Attkisson. So who is this Red Slash cat closing Snoog's RfC for him? I see zzuuzz recently took away Mr. Slash's page mover rights.

Are Red Slash & Red Pen of Doom in complementary distribution?

You would think Tulsi wouldn't matter, but somehow, very weirdly, she does still seem to matter to some Dems, who seem to be rather afraid of their shadows these days. ^^

Randy from Boise · Unread post by **Randy from Boise** » Fri Jul 12, 2019 2:44 am

Guido den Broeder wrote:
Poetlister wrote:This is the problem with BLPs on Wikipedia. Many if not most BLPs of prominent people are affected by the house POV, which is generally left of centre.
Keep in mind that what in the US counts as 'left of centre', is considered 'slightly less to the far right' in other parts of the world.

That's a gross overstatement. Also: the Democratic Party is moving left. The difference between the Ds and Original Recipe Labour in the UK is slight.

RfB

Unread post by **Smiley** » Fri Jul 12, 2019 4:19 am

In Russia Today:

"‘Reputation managers’ get to work scrubbing Clinton-Epstein connection from Wikipedia" 10 Jul 2019

RT wrote:The internet's unofficial Ministry of Truth has been hard at work trying to memory-hole links between former US President Bill Clinton and financier Jeffrey Epstein, who was recently arrested and charged with sex trafficking.

Epstein’s Wikipedia bio came in for some quick whitewashing, with one editor removing multiple references to Bill Clinton flying on the billionaire’s private jet – nicknamed the Lolita Express – on Sunday morning, after the news of Epstein’s arrest broke. The fact that Clinton had flown on the jet 26 times, despite being well-sourced and not in dispute, was “not relevant to [Epstein’s] personal life,” editor ‘Joeblacko (T-C-L)’ complained, calling it “a smear toward bill Clinton.”

An eagle-eyed Wikipedia reader spotted the edit, however, and called in the cavalry with a tweet comparing ‘before’ and ‘after’ versions of the article that was reposted to Reddit’s The_Donald community. By Sunday evening, the material had been re-added by user ‘BD2412 (T-C-L),’ who slapped a week-long “protection” on the article, preventing drive-by edits by new and unregistered users.

Clinton’s denial of the “26 flights” number was added to the article on Tuesday night by user ‘Soibangla (T-C-L),’ a known quantity in the American politics topic area, who also tweaked a Clinton quote praising Epstein, noting there was “no evidence [Clinton and Epstein] were ‘friends.’”

Among the other editors making changes to Epstein’s page was the notorious Philip Cross (T-C-L), a mysterious British figure who has edited Wikipedia for 15 years for the equivalent of full-time working hours, with a single-minded dedication to negatively skewing the biographies of antiwar politicians and journalists. Cross was relatively well-behaved in the Epstein article, however, restricting his actions to copy-edits and smoothing out text.

Wikipedia co-founder Jimmy Wales even stopped by, to add a citation confirming the fact that Clinton had taken 26 flights on the Lolita Express. Wales has spoken at Clinton Global Initiative events and once called up Hillary Clinton's office to find out how she would prefer to be listed on Wikipedia.

“When the spotlight's off Epstein, the Clinton mentions can be edited out like they should be,” editor Cramyourspam (T-C-L) snarked on the article’s talk page, referring to the usual drop-off in editor interest when a subject moves out of the news. “We're an academic/journalistic resource. With that role comes a social responsibility to soil one political side and shine another.”

mendaliv · Unread post by **mendaliv** » Fri Jul 12, 2019 4:34 am

Dammit RT, why can't you point out that everyone on Wikipedia is distracted by Framgate?

Unread post by **Midsize Jake** » Fri Jul 12, 2019 4:52 am

Smiley wrote:In Russia Today:

"‘Reputation managers’ get to work scrubbing Clinton-Epstein connection from Wikipedia" 10 Jul 2019

No byline, so my guess would be that the article was written by Putin himself.

Randy from Boise · Unread post by **Randy from Boise** » Fri Jul 12, 2019 5:00 am

Midsize Jake wrote:
Smiley wrote:In Russia Today:

"‘Reputation managers’ get to work scrubbing Clinton-Epstein connection from Wikipedia" 10 Jul 2019
No byline, so my guess would be that the article was written by Putin himself.

No byline so that if Putin's policy gets changed it gives the author a running start escaping from the Федеральная служба безопасности (FSB).

RfB

Unread post by **tarantino** » Fri Jul 12, 2019 8:46 pm

Guido den Broeder wrote:
Vigilant wrote:https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?ti ... =905485454
Makes me wonder if Wales was one of those friends, or aspired to be one.

Epstein knows Tony Blair, so he may know Jimmy.
Epstein's little black book (from 2009 maybe?) is here. I haven't looked through all 92 pages, though.

Guido den Broeder · Unread post by **Guido den Broeder** » Fri Jul 12, 2019 9:04 pm

tarantino wrote:
Guido den Broeder wrote:
Vigilant wrote:https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?ti ... =905485454
Makes me wonder if Wales was one of those friends, or aspired to be one.
Epstein knows Tony Blair, so he may know Jimmy.
Epstein's little black book (from 2009 maybe?) is here. I haven't looked through all 92 pages, though.

Science dinner, San Francisco 2008. Jimmy was there.

Poetlister · Unread post by **Poetlister** » Fri Jul 12, 2019 9:36 pm

Randy from Boise wrote:The difference between the Ds and Original Recipe Labour in the UK is slight.

What?!? What is Original Recipe Labour?

Unread post by **Zoloft** » Sat Jul 13, 2019 12:43 am

Poetlister wrote:
Randy from Boise wrote:The difference between the Ds and Original Recipe Labour in the UK is slight.
What?!? What is Original Recipe Labour?

It's before they added the extra breading.

Katnips · Unread post by **Katnips** » Sat Jul 13, 2019 2:10 am

Bezdomni wrote:Snoog oddly seems to be always seeking fame. I think he's hoping for extensive coverage from Attkisson. So who is this Red Slash cat closing Snoog's RfC for him? I see zzuuzz recently took away Mr. Slash's page mover rights.

Are Red Slash & Red Pen of Doom in complementary distribution?

You would think Tulsi wouldn't matter, but somehow, very weirdly, she does still seem to matter to some Dems, who seem to be rather afraid of their shadows these days. ^^

Meanwhile, Snoogans evidently continues to fly under the radar with edits like this: https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?ti ... =905987444

He says the current (Republican) Tennessee Governor signed a law to create a day honoring a Confederate soldier and KKK leader (yikes, right?!)...Meanwhile, the source https://www.tennessean.com/story/news/p ... 684059001/he uses says the holiday was created in 1921 and it is in Tennessee state law that every Governor must sign a law each year proclaiming it a holiday, and that in fact every Governor has done this (including the current Gov's Democratic predecessor). Incredibly deceitful, disingenuous editing, trying to tie current Gov. to a law that has literally been on the books for 98 years. Imagine the outrage if this was added to a D's page. Interestingly, he seems to have forgotten to add the same content to the former Dem. Gov's page, although he too signed the same proclamation. Whoops! Guess he forgot!

Evidently Snoogs can just do whatever he likes....here's betting Neutrality comes along any minute to clean up any typos left behind.

Poetlister · Unread post by **Poetlister** » Sat Jul 13, 2019 6:36 pm

According to the same source, "Ted Cruz denounces Nathan Bedford Forrest Day: ‘This is WRONG.’" If it's too right wing for Ted Cruz, it's bad! It's correct that the governor is implementing long-standing state law, but couldn't he have found a less controversial character? Anyway, this is rather

Bezdomni · Unread post by **Bezdomni** » Sun Jul 14, 2019 12:41 pm

Hm. I hadn't remembered that (the fictional character) Forrest Gump was named for that guy.

Meanwhile, back to Epstein, I see some of the supporting evidence for banning someone from American Politics recently was that he mentioned ( § ) that Epstein's plane was called the Lolita Express. Odd, that. Must be the close association with the Clinton name? That said, the second part of the contribution is not, in fact, part of the article title.

Snoog was involved, as were the usual suspects (Drmies, Bishonen, Vanamonde93, Awilley, ...) The idea that the DSA is not dedicated to phasing out (crisis/vulture) capitalism is pretty interesting. I'd thought they were meant to be taken seriously.

Poetlister · Unread post by **Poetlister** » Sun Jul 14, 2019 2:19 pm

Bezdomni wrote:I'd thought they were meant to be taken seriously.

I was going to say that most American politics can't be taken seriously. However, alas, the shenanigans do have real-world consequences for Britain and other countries.

Moral Hazard · Unread post by **Moral Hazard** » Sun Jul 14, 2019 8:30 pm

Bezdomni wrote:The idea that the DSA is not dedicated to phasing out (crisis/vulture) capitalism is pretty interesting.

DSA's predecesssor (DSOC) was founded to replace capitalism with socialism, after Michael Harrington's faction lost when the Socialist Party changed its name to Social Democrats, USA. Harrington was a nice guy who tried to defeat reactionary politicians.

Harrington's clones lost control of DSA in 2017, and many of them quit in disgust. The organization is increasingly sectarian, with the majority's elected leadership posing as revolutionary Marxist. The exuberant youth were chanting "From the River to the Sea, Palestine will be free". They expelled an elected member of their national board for the sin of having organized for a police union.

Randy from Boise · Unread post by **Randy from Boise** » Mon Jul 15, 2019 2:00 am

............Fuckin' millennials...

On the other hand, you (predictably) overstate.

RfB

Moral Hazard · Unread post by **Moral Hazard** » Mon Jul 15, 2019 11:54 am

If you want urls, just ask.
Do you feel lucky?

Unread post by **Smiley** » Tue Jul 16, 2019 8:04 am

The TerraMar Project (T-H-L)

Ghislaine Maxwell's front for sex trafficking of minors oceanic awareness charity.

Unread post by **Smiley** » Tue Jul 16, 2019 8:31 am

Guilt by association perhaps, but Matthew Freud (T-H-L) is listed in Epstein's Little Black Book.

Matthew Freud founded PR firm Freud Communications (T-H-L), employer of Jimmy Wales' spouse Kate Garvey (T-H-L).

Matthew Freud's father (In)Clement Freud (T-H-L) was a famous dog-food salesman and paedophile.

His great-grandfather was also a notorious nutjob.

Bezdomni · Unread post by **Bezdomni** » Tue Jul 16, 2019 10:56 am

Moral Hazard wrote: They expelled an elected member of their national board for the sin of having organized for a police union.

I'll bite, got a source? I just recently learned with some dismay that years ago I may have grossed 100€-200€ or so (through an intermediary) for language training at the modern rebranding of the Pinkerton Detective Agency. I guess we're all complicit.

Poetlister · Unread post by **Poetlister** » Tue Jul 16, 2019 3:37 pm

Smiley wrote:Guilt by association perhaps, but Matthew Freud (T-H-L) is listed in Epstein's Little Black Book.

Matthew Freud founded PR firm Freud Communications (T-H-L), employer of Jimmy Wales' spouse Kate Garvey (T-H-L).

Matthew Freud's father (In)Clement Freud (T-H-L) was a famous dog-food salesman and paedophile.

His great-grandfather was also a notorious nutjob.

We don't know Clement Freud's side of this and presumably never will. I'm not aware that Matthew Freud or indeed Sigmund Freud (T-H-L) has ever been accused of child molesting. No doubt there are many people in the Little Black Book who are totally innocent of Epstein's crimes.

Unread post by **Smiley** » Tue Jul 16, 2019 4:03 pm

Poetlister wrote:We don't know Clement Freud's side of this and presumably never will.

After Clement's death his wife (herself no slouch when it came to the rocking of cradles) apologized to the victims.

Telegraph wrote:In a statement made to the programme makers, the widowed Lady Freud, now 89, did not deny the allegations, or mention being surprised by them, simply saying that she was “profoundly sorry” for the women involved. Yesterday, Matthew Freud cancelled his high-profile annual summer party he was due to hold last night at his Primrose Hill home.

In 2001, Jonathan Self, older brother of the more famous Will, the novelist, revealed that he had had a five-year affair with Jill Freud, when he was 17 and she was 47.

Poetlister · Unread post by **Poetlister** » Tue Jul 16, 2019 8:26 pm

A cynic might wonder if she was traducing her husband's memory to cover up her own misdemeanours. But this is

Unread post by **Smiley** » Sat Aug 10, 2019 1:18 pm

Looks like Epstein's dead again, lol

Unread post by **Smiley** » Sat Aug 10, 2019 1:35 pm

Randy from Boise · Unread post by **Randy from Boise** » Sat Aug 10, 2019 2:52 pm

Smiley wrote:Looks like Epstein's dead again, lol

Only if you believe the New York Times...

https://www.nytimes.com/2019/08/10/nyre ... icide.html

The loud sigh of relief you hear is just Bill Clinton. Trump's advisors are no doubt sussing out a posthumous pardon.

RfB

Poetlister · Unread post by **Poetlister** » Sat Aug 10, 2019 4:11 pm

Randy from Boise wrote:
Smiley wrote:Looks like Epstein's dead again, lol
Only if you believe the New York Times...

https://www.nytimes.com/2019/08/10/nyre ... icide.html

The loud sigh of relief you hear is just Bill Clinton. Trump's advisors are no doubt sussing out a posthumous pardon.

RfB

As all Trump followers know, anything in the NYT is fake news.

Randy from Boise · Unread post by **Randy from Boise** » Sat Aug 10, 2019 6:23 pm

The right wing conspiracy theorists are gonna have a field day with this. In federal custody, taken off suicide watch, guards conveniently out of the loop for a couple critical hours.... Clinton starts with K for kill, does it not?

Just watch...

RfB

Poetlister · Unread post by **Poetlister** » Sat Aug 10, 2019 8:21 pm

Trump has his own motives and of course much more influence at present than Clinton. Trump used to go to Epstein's parties and said he was fun, while acknowledging that some of his girlfriends wwere rather young, so he knew what Epstein was up to and still went to his parties.

rhindle · Unread post by **rhindle** » Sat Aug 10, 2019 8:23 pm

Twitter is a complete mess over this today. Some are trying to be the voices of reason but confirmation bias is a powerful force.

Poetlister · Unread post by **Poetlister** » Sat Aug 10, 2019 8:30 pm

rhindle wrote:Twitter is a complete mess over this today. Some are trying to be the voices of reason but confirmation bias is a powerful force.

You can't expect much sense on Twitter Anyone can post.

Randy from Boise · Unread post by **Randy from Boise** » Sun Aug 11, 2019 2:26 am

Captain Obvious wrote:The right wing conspiracy theorists are gonna have a field day with this. In federal custody, taken off suicide watch, guards conveniently out of the loop for a couple critical hours.... Clinton starts with K for kill, does it not?

Just watch...

RfB

Poetlister wrote:Trump has his own motives and of course much more influence at present than Clinton. Trump used to go to Epstein's parties and said he was fun, while acknowledging that some of his girlfriends wwere rather young, so he knew what Epstein was up to and still went to his parties.

You could never be an American conservative, you're too rational.

RfB

Now playing on Breitbart...

Unread post by **Midsize Jake** » Sun Aug 11, 2019 6:02 am

Randy from Boise wrote:Now playing on Breitbart...

Well, all I can say is that if the Clintons did put down Epstein, at least they're at lot more effective at removing pedophiles than the Wikimedia Foundation.

Poetlister · Unread post by **Poetlister** » Sun Aug 11, 2019 6:25 am

Randy from Boise wrote:You could never be an American conservative, you're too rational.

Thank you. That's the nicest compliment I've been paid recently.

Randy from Boise · Unread post by **Randy from Boise** » Sun Aug 11, 2019 9:40 am

Midsize Jake wrote:
Randy from Boise wrote:Now playing on Breitbart...
Well, all I can say is that if the Clintons did put down Epstein, at least they're at lot more effective at removing pedophiles than the Wikimedia Foundation.

The squeaing Breitbart loons even have a word for it: Arkancide.

In the land of Conspiratoria this is gonna be bigger than (Vince Foster + Benghazi + Pizzagate) x 2

RfB

Kumioko · Unread post by **Kumioko** » Sun Aug 11, 2019 3:26 pm

I wouldn't be shocked if Jimbo is named as someone who participated in one of Epsteins party's.

Poetlister · Unread post by **Poetlister** » Sun Aug 11, 2019 4:08 pm

Kumioko wrote:I wouldn't be shocked if Jimbo isn't named as someone who participated in one of Epsteins party's.

Do you mean "isn't" or "is"?

Kumioko · Unread post by **Kumioko** » Sun Aug 11, 2019 4:16 pm

Poetlister wrote:
Kumioko wrote:I wouldn't be shocked if Jimbo isn't named as someone who participated in one of Epsteins party's.
Do you mean "isn't" or "is"?

Yeah, damn phone keeps autocorrecting.