The e-cigarette war

[tarantino]

Wikipedia:Arbitration/Requests/Case/Editor conduct in e-cigs articles (T-H-L)

[The Joy]

Wikipedia:Arbitration/Requests/Case/Editor conduct in e-cigs articles (T-H-L)

A decision should have been made on September 1st. What on earth is causing the delay?

[SB_Johnny]

Wikipedia:Arbitration/Requests/Case/Editor conduct in e-cigs articles (T-H-L)

A decision should have been made on September 1st. What on earth is causing the delay?

Perhaps we're finally seeing the day where even the Arbitration Committee members have realized that the rest of life is more important than Wikidrama, and just don't spend all of their free time suffering fools and foolishness?

[Randy from Boise]

Wikipedia:Arbitration/Requests/Case/Editor conduct in e-cigs articles (T-H-L)

A decision should have been made on September 1st. What on earth is causing the delay?

Perhaps we're finally seeing the day where even the Arbitration Committee members have realized that the rest of life is more important than Wikidrama, and just don't spend all of their free time suffering fools and foolishness?

What are people gonna do, take them to ArbCom for blowing off deadlines???

It seems that every successive ArbCom does a worse and worse job of it. Lightbreather was left dangling in the wind for over a month.

RfB

[Cla68]

Wikipedia:Arbitration/Requests/Case/Editor conduct in e-cigs articles (T-H-L)

A decision should have been made on September 1st. What on earth is causing the delay?

Perhaps we're finally seeing the day where even the Arbitration Committee members have realized that the rest of life is more important than Wikidrama, and just don't spend all of their free time suffering fools and foolishness?

What are people gonna do, take them to ArbCom for blowing off deadlines???

It seems that every successive ArbCom does a worse and worse job of it. Lightbreather was left dangling in the wind for over a month.

RfB

With as much money as the WMF has, you would think they could pay ArbCom members a salary so they could do this full time? Of course, the WMF wouldn't do that because it would expose them to liability for what takes place in WP and also it would force them to pay salaries to the ArbCom members of ALL the language Wikipedias.

[MMAR]

It's a disgrace how long Wikipedia's coverage of e-cigs has been allowed to be ridiculously over-cautious. While their inherent safety might still be in doubt compared to not using them at all, you'd have to be a complete and utter moron to think that you're not doing any actual smoker any harm by hinting to them through Wikipedia that maybe they shouldn't switch because of all the 'unknown unknowns'. For failing to control the tiny few activists who have done this, considering what we do know about the risks of continued smoking, Wikipedia definitely has blood on its hands.

[Poetlister]

and also it would force them to pay salaries to the ArbCom members of ALL the language Wikipedias.

Worse, they might even have to pay the Wikinews ArbCom, where only three people voted in the last election.

[MMAR]

Mandate-tastic.

[The Joy]

Wikipedia:Arbitration/Requests/Case/Editor conduct in e-cigs articles (T-H-L)

A decision should have been made on September 1st. What on earth is causing the delay?

Perhaps we're finally seeing the day where even the Arbitration Committee members have realized that the rest of life is more important than Wikidrama, and just don't spend all of their free time suffering fools and foolishness?

What are people gonna do, take them to ArbCom for blowing off deadlines???

It seems that every successive ArbCom does a worse and worse job of it. Lightbreather was left dangling in the wind for over a month.

RfB

With as much money as the WMF has, you would think they could pay ArbCom members a salary so they could do this full time? Of course, the WMF wouldn't do that because it would expose them to liability for what takes place in WP and also it would force them to pay salaries to the ArbCom members of ALL the language Wikipedias.

Maybe the WMF could offer Arbcom discounts to their store products as long as they work hard. Not working and meeting deadlines!? No 10% discount on your "Wikipedia content policies plantable pencils!"

https://store.wikimedia.org/products/wi ... ils-3-pack

(We need a separate thread on those absurd store products. Why on earth would I want to plant a pencil except into some wiki-jerk's eye? )

[Drijfzand]

Interesting tactics used by QuackGuru. Keeps people from commenting on his talk page by using a red link in his signature, and nominates his own articles for deletion, for example here and here.
The net result is a "speedy keep" notice on the talk page (This page was nominated for deletion on .... The result of the discussion was speedy keep.) which will likely discourage other editors from trying AfD.

[Kelly Martin]

Of course, the WMF wouldn't do that because it would expose them to liability for what takes place in WP and also it would force them to pay salaries to the ArbCom members of ALL the language Wikipedias.

It would not expose them to liability; the theory that it would is a convenient but utterly false excuse used by the WMF, and blithely accepted by Wikipedians, to justify taking no action.

[NativeForeigner]

Wikipedia:Arbitration/Requests/Case/Editor conduct in e-cigs articles (T-H-L)

A decision should have been made on September 1st. What on earth is causing the delay?

Perhaps we're finally seeing the day where even the Arbitration Committee members have realized that the rest of life is more important than Wikidrama, and just don't spend all of their free time suffering fools and foolishness?

What are people gonna do, take them to ArbCom for blowing off deadlines???

It seems that every successive ArbCom does a worse and worse job of it. Lightbreather was left dangling in the wind for over a month.

RfB

With as much money as the WMF has, you would think they could pay ArbCom members a salary so they could do this full time? Of course, the WMF wouldn't do that because it would expose them to liability for what takes place in WP and also it would force them to pay salaries to the ArbCom members of ALL the language Wikipedias.

Maybe the WMF could offer Arbcom discounts to their store products as long as they work hard. Not working and meeting deadlines!? No 10% discount on your "Wikipedia content policies plantable pencils!"

https://store.wikimedia.org/products/wi ... ils-3-pack

(We need a separate thread on those absurd store products. Why on earth would I want to plant a pencil except into some wiki-jerk's eye? )

Made me laugh. I guess the check's in the mail...

I will say meeting a couple other arbs in DC was probably a lot more productive thna a week or two on mailing list. Funny how that works.

[ferongr]

The ArbCom case is closed. QuackGuru (T-C-L) gets a slap on the wrist, Doc James' friend/student CFCF (T-C-L) gets a slightly harder slap on the wrist and AlbinoFerret (T-C-L), who had a 6-month self ban started an ARCA to submit evidence against Quacky and Cloudjpk (T-C-L) who seems to be linked to Quackguru. The article remains in a terrible state 1 year after I first started reading it.

Disclosure: I'm not a Wikipedia editor, I'm just a vaper and my first contact with Wikipediocracy and Wikipedia internal processes in general was when researching who where the different names on this article's talkpage, most notably Quackguru who even to a noob like me seemed to be behaving and editing strangely, and Doc James who made some personal statements a "scientist" would not had made. I cannot claim to be unbiased, I'm just interested in watching the article's development, in parallel with the media battles raging with regards to vaping.

[Jim]

The ArbCom case is closed. QuackGuru (T-C-L) gets a slap on the wrist, Doc James' friend/student CFCF (T-C-L) gets a slightly harder slap on the wrist and AlbinoFerret (T-C-L), who had a 6-month self ban started an ARCA to submit evidence against Quacky and Cloudjpk (T-C-L) who seems to be linked to Quackguru. The article remains in a terrible state 1 year after I first started reading it.

Disclosure: I'm not a Wikipedia editor, I'm just a vaper and my first contact with Wikipediocracy and Wikipedia internal processes in general was when researching who where the different names on this article's talkpage, most notably Quackguru who even to a noob like me seemed to be behaving and editing strangely, and Doc James who made some personal statements a "scientist" would not had made. I cannot claim to be unbiased, I'm just interested in watching the article's development, in parallel with the media battles raging with regards to vaping.

Well, , ferongr.

On wikipedia, you'd be blocked as a "sock" for "using templates on your first edit". It's not like that here.

Do those e-cig things really work? Genuinely asking.

[ferongr]

I had my first cigarette-free anniversary yesterday. I used to be a 2 pack-a-day smoker before. I'd say they've worked for me and my father, who started using e-cigarettes mainly for the financial aspect (he went from spending 200€/mo on cigarettes to spending 10-20€ on eliquid that I mix for him. Subjectively, my respiratory system feels a lot better.

[Jim]

I had my first cigarette-free anniversary yesterday. I used to be a 2 pack-a-day smoker before. I'd say they've worked for me and my father, who started using e-cigarettes mainly for the financial aspect (he went from spending 200€/mo on cigarettes to spending 10-20€ on eliquid that I mix for him. Subjectively, my respiratory system feels a lot better.

Thank you. You did more than just answer the (poor) question I asked, by relating it to real people. What's eliquid?

[ats]

What's eliquid?

Its basically a mixture of water and nicotine that generally has other aromatics and flavorings added to it. It is basically what is used to form the vapor that a user "smokes" with an ecig.

[Poetlister]

I had my first cigarette-free anniversary yesterday. I used to be a 2 pack-a-day smoker before. I'd say they've worked for me and my father, who started using e-cigarettes mainly for the financial aspect (he went from spending 200€/mo on cigarettes to spending 10-20€ on eliquid that I mix for him. Subjectively, my respiratory system feels a lot better.

Had you tried anything else before, like nicotine chewing gum?

[ferongr]

I tried chewing gum in the past with minimal results. During the last of my 5 day nic gum adventure, I was going through them at such a high rate that my mouth muscles hurt from all that chewing. I was also slightly agitated and managed to destroy two ballpoint pens by chewing on them. A different attempt with patches lasted only two days. They were kinda worse from a feeling perspective (nothing to occupy my mouth). I couldn't afford to pay for sessions in a clinic specializing in smoking cessation so I can't comment on that thing.

What's eliquid?

Its basically a mixture of water and nicotine that generally has other aromatics and flavorings added to it. It is basically what is used to form the vapor that a user "smokes" with an ecig.

The bulk of the ingredients in eliquid are polypropylene glycol (the dreaded "antifreeze") and vegetable glycerin, anywhere from 60 to 90% in various mixtures. Propylene glycol simulates the throat hit of a cigarette and vegetable glycerin forms visible droplets that simulate the exhaled smoke. The latter is called vapor, "aerosol" (if you want to be strictly technical and create impressions), or "cloud" (a term the lifestyle vaper scene uses). Other ingredients include a variety of flavorings in various amounts (usually anywhere around 1% to 20%, purified water (mostly to decrease the viscosity of the eliquid) and nicotine in concentrations 3.6% or lower. There are also eliquids without nicotine.

[Vigilant]

I quit smoking by refusing to buy cigarettes.

Took me about 5 attempts before I hit on the strategy that worked for me.

[Cla68]

The ArbCom case is closed. QuackGuru (T-C-L) gets a slap on the wrist, Doc James' friend/student CFCF (T-C-L) gets a slightly harder slap on the wrist and AlbinoFerret (T-C-L), who had a 6-month self ban started an ARCA to submit evidence against Quacky and Cloudjpk (T-C-L) who seems to be linked to Quackguru. The article remains in a terrible state 1 year after I first started reading it.

Disclosure: I'm not a Wikipedia editor, I'm just a vaper and my first contact with Wikipediocracy and Wikipedia internal processes in general was when researching who where the different names on this article's talkpage, most notably Quackguru who even to a noob like me seemed to be behaving and editing strangely, and Doc James who made some personal statements a "scientist" would not had made. I cannot claim to be unbiased, I'm just interested in watching the article's development, in parallel with the media battles raging with regards to vaping.

Quackguru has an account here. He can correct me if I'm wrong, but he and Doc James probably sincerely feel that they're saving humanity, whom they appear to believe are collectively a bunch of simpering idiots, from themselves by influencing their behavior and choices through biased Wikipedia articles.

[Zoloft]

... Quackguru has an account here. ...

Not that I know of.

[Cla68]

... Quackguru has an account here. ...

Not that I know of.

OK, I think I mixed him up with RedPenOfDoom.

[Poetlister]

I quit smoking by refusing to buy cigarettes.

Took me about 5 attempts before I hit on the strategy that worked for me.

Everyone is different. Whatever strategy works for you is fine. I hope you feel better for quitting.

[Vigilant]

I quit smoking by refusing to buy cigarettes.

Took me about 5 attempts before I hit on the strategy that worked for me.

Everyone is different. Whatever strategy works for you is fine. I hope you feel better for quitting.

I do. It's been a couple of years now.

[ferongr]

Quackguru (T-C-L) started an AE complaint against S Marshall (T-C-L). In the usual Quacky stream-of-consciousness editing style, he initially asks for a block on S Marshall accusing him of being an SPA. He then edits that and accuses him of socking while using some weaksauce proof. In the end, Quackguru himself ends up receiving a six month topic ban by AE from all ecig articles for continuing his shenanigans immidiately after getting warned from the Arbcom case. Fun times ahead.