Jimbo shares a $1,000,000 award with Berners-Lee

Notvelty · Unread post by **Notvelty** » Wed Jan 21, 2015 3:23 am

Dear buddies,

Now that I am supplying my own solicitor, can I suggest that the payments that were going to her now go to me.

Yours,
DerNotJimbo

thekohser · Unread post by **thekohser** » Wed Jan 21, 2015 3:26 am

According to Ms. Kopel's LinkedIn, since 2002 she has held 15 different jobs that she felt worth listing.

Kind of fascinating how much she "big ups" her past service to Jimbo, yet there's never been a mention of her on Wikipedia until today, nor has the news media ever mentioned her relationship to Jimmy Wales.

Notvelty · Unread post by **Notvelty** » Wed Jan 21, 2015 3:41 am

thekohser wrote:According to Ms. Kopel's LinkedIn, since 2002 she has held 15 different jobs that she felt worth listing.

Ah, but you're sheltered by working for a functioning private sector company. That sort of list is gold for scooping up government or government-grant-funded contracts due to the rigid, templated rules about equal opportunity that apply.

I haven't read the resume (can't be stuffed changing my linkedin search settings) but I'd be not surprised at all if she's managed to shoehorn something about sexual preference in there too - possibly an advisory role to a socially acceptable gender rights group. I know I would if I worked in her field.

Vigilant · Unread post by **Vigilant** » Wed Jan 21, 2015 4:16 am

Jesus.

I can't believe I called it.

The Adversary · Unread post by **The Adversary** » Wed Jan 21, 2015 5:55 am

According to this Orit Kopel was the new Israel education ambassador in 2013 for StandWithUs (T-H-L).

That´s about as pro-Israeli as they come.

And here she is pictured with Israeli President Shimon Peres.

DanMurphy · Unread post by **DanMurphy** » Wed Jan 21, 2015 11:59 am

The Adversary wrote:According to this Orit Kopel was the new Israel education ambassador in 2013 for StandWithUs (T-H-L).

Adversary is being a little restrained. StandWithUs is a propaganda outfit, with close ties to Netanyahu's office and the settler movement. The group (of course) has also been involved in teaching students to edit Wikipedia as part of Israeli hasbara.

Unread post by **HRIP7** » Wed Jan 21, 2015 12:15 pm

Midsize Jake wrote:Jimbo posted a talk page entry about this today in which he stated they were "nearly done with the filing documents to register the organization formally," and named the "human rights lawyer" he'd hired to run the organization - this turns out to be a Ms. Orit Kopel, an Israeli national with a law degree from Hebrew University (and a recently-obtained Master's in International Law from the London School of Economics) who also has spent some time in the US, apparently. Impressive educational credentials, but very little experience - I guess that's understandable though, since $500K isn't really all that much seed money, when you get right down to it - someone with a track record would probably take up half the principal in salary over the first 2-3 years, assuming the ride lasts that long.

Ms. Kopel tweets in Hebrew, but from what I gather she's firmly enough on the Israeli side of the Israeli-Arab dispute to likely make the UAE's Shaikh Ahmed bin Mohammed bin Rashid Al Maktoum somewhat miffed about how his money is being spent. Which, to a cynical person such as myself, could represent a deliberate move by Jimbo to prove to his critics that he can't be "bought." I guess I can't really blame him, though, and more importantly, if this does end up amounting to something real and positive, we'll probably owe him an apology for doubting his intentions (though to be fair, Jimbo's own track record did make those doubts justifiable). Oh well!

Your idea that support for Netanyahu and Peres is somehow incompatible with support for the UAE is very much mistaken.

Anshel Pfeffer, Haaretz, 23 April 2014: Tony Blair just endorsed Benjamin Netanyahu's worldview

The inescapable conclusion from reading the full text of former British Prime Minister Tony Blair's speech on Islamic extremism on Wednesday in London is that it could have been an address by Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu.

Middle-East Eye, 24 June 2014: Blair finds 'chemistry' with Abu Dhabi's crown prince

Former British Prime Minister Tony Blair is working closely with Emirati Crown Prince Mohammed bin Zayed al-Nahyan on issues relating to regional security and the Muslim Brotherhood, according to a report published in the Financial Times (FT) on Monday.

The story cites sources close to Blair as saying he is overseeing a report investigating allegations the Muslim Brotherhood are involved with terrorism, accusations which have been made by military-led authorities in Egypt and their financial backers in the Gulf who vehemently oppose the group’s moderate Islamist ideology.

While members of Blair’s staff say the report is for his “personal use”, the FT’s sources say it is being written for the UAE’s leaders, principally Sheikh Mohammed with whom the newspaper says the former prime minister shares “chemistry”. A diplomat who is aware of the briefing document told the FT its purpose will be to “inform” publics in the West on the “dangers” posed by the Brotherhood.

Since he stood down as the British premier in 2007, Tony Blair has built myriad business interests around the world, many of which involve advising governments, dictators and high profile financial institutions. The complexity of his dealings make it a challenge to accurately estimate his earnings, although accounts published in January this year showed he has £13 mn deposited in the bank and various newspaper reports estimated his personal wealth at being around the £70 mn mark.

Tonyblairoffice.org, 15 July 2014: Tony Blair meets with President Peres

Tony Blair wrote:As you know, I'm a fully paid up member of the Peres fan club but this devotion is based on experience and my experience of this man over many years has been as follows. He is an outstanding leader, he is a magnificent servant of the State of Israel, he is a striver for peace and above all else, though he is Israeli to the core, we regard him as a citizen of the world. He is a truly global leader.

Over the years I have watched him with admiration, I've tried to borrow or steal his best lines, sometimes successfully and sometimes less so. I have no doubt that when he leaves this role he will continue to play his part in peace, in bringing people together and in creating a better world. I've never known anyone who ceaselessly is able to create, to innovate and to renew both himself and those around him. So dear Shimon I'd like to take this opportunity to say on behalf of the world actually, thank you for all that you've done.

Poetlister · Unread post by **Poetlister** » Wed Jan 21, 2015 1:00 pm

Midsize Jake wrote:Ms. Kopel tweets in Hebrew

She appears to be an attractive brunette (surprise). Her tweets look pretty trivial. A typical one says

"It took 22 minutes for the service representative to answer. It took me 22 minutes to figure out his Scottish accent."

====

Andreas: However much the rulers of countries like Saudi Arabia and the UAE detest Israel, they scarcely see it as an existential threat to themselves. They are far more worried about extremists like ISIL and Hamas.

Unread post by **HRIP7** » Wed Jan 21, 2015 2:13 pm

Poetlister wrote:Andreas: However much the rulers of countries like Saudi Arabia and the UAE detest Israel, they scarcely see it as an existential threat to themselves. They are far more worried about extremists like ISIL and Hamas.

Hamas has roots in the Muslim Brotherhood, recently designated a terrorist group by the UAE government. Do you think there is merit to the reasoning in this article?

Sawsan Ramahi, Middle East Monitor, 29 September 2014: The Muslim Brotherhood and Salafist Jihad (ISIS): different ideologies, different methodologies

It is almost certain that any unbiased individual looking into the modern history of Islamic movements will not be able to overlook the reality under which these groups were formed. This reality included a decline in Islam's political role, especially after the fall of the Ottoman Empire in the early 20th century and the Western colonisation of Arab and Islamic lands. All the indigenous people could then do was resist this colonialism and drive it out of their countries, in the belief that by doing so they would gain their freedom. They discovered, though, that their home-grown leaders were the ugliest of oppressors supported by the West as long as they benefitted Western interests, even when such leaders contravened democratic norms and human rights by their actions.

When popular political movements and moderate Islamic groups tried to resist the oppression of the ruling families and military regimes, they were imprisoned and subjected to the worst forms of physical and psychological torture; during the rule of Gamal Abdel Nasser in Egypt, the prisons were equally full of those following communist and Islamic ideologies. Islamist groups with extremist ideas, which abandoned societies they believed to be blasphemous, were born behind bars; this led to governments labelling all Islamist groups as extremist and radical. The authorities in the West then used this label within the concept of the "war on terror" and the media began describing Islam as the religion of terrorism. This in turn allowed Western re-occupation of the Middle East, represented by America and its allies, through the wars waged on Afghanistan and Iraq, with the aim of democracy tailored to the standards of the occupiers.

When the Arab nations took action to change this painful reality and revolted against oppression and injustice, applied democracy and elected their leaders, the moderate Islamists were the biggest winners. It was at this point that the world began plotting and supported, albeit indirectly and often covertly, the counter-revolutions. Western fears that democracy would liberate countries across the region from their dependency on the US and its protégé Israel drove them to abandon the very same democratic principles that the West claimed to have stood and fought for.

However, America and its allies overlooked the fact that this would, almost inevitably, push ordinary people towards extremism; the West would learn to regret this oversight on its leaders' part. It is thus reasonable, I believe, to say that ISIS and the US-led coalition lining up against it came about as a direct result of the Western-approved oppression of moderate Islamic movements in the Arab world. It seems that the administrations in Washington, London, Paris and Berlin, as well as Riyadh, Abu Dhabi and Cairo, have not learnt from previous experiences. Their unlimited support for despots led to the emergence of Al-Qaeda and now their coup against the people's revolution has brought them ISIS; when will the West learn?

The Western and Arab media have engaged in the struggle with all the means at their disposal, portraying all Islamic movements as extremists. The message is clear: there are no moderate Islamist groups and the Salafist jihadist groups, including Al-Qaeda and ISIS, all emerged from moderate Islam, which is represented by the Muslim Brotherhood; ergo they are one and the same. We need to clarify this misconception with a look at the ideologies of the Muslim Brotherhood and the Salafist jihadist groups, the most recent of which is ISIS, which also requires a look at Wahhabi Salafism, known simply as Wahhabism. [...]

eagle · Unread post by **eagle** » Wed Jan 21, 2015 2:20 pm

The underlying point of this thread is that the prize was designed to "buy friends and influence people." If it had been awarded to the WMF in recognition of its contribution to the dissemination of world knowledge, it would have paid a bunch of programmers in San Francisco without earning much gratitude toward the UAE. But by giving the money to Mr. Wales personally, he can "buy" the friendship and loyalty of some A-list Israeli lawyer which will buy further good will in the inner circles of the politically connected to the benefit of both Mr. Wales and the UAE. So, the charitable mission which inspired the award is not furthered and human rights are not furthered, but Mr. Wales' nest is feathered.

DanMurphy · Unread post by **DanMurphy** » Wed Jan 21, 2015 2:22 pm

Israel and the UAE have many interests in common (Iran, anti-MB, Sunni regime stability) and are (privately) on friendly terms. There are of course hiccups.

At any rate, Maktoum won't care that Wales' employee is an Israeli. This tangent seems just a tad off topic. The key bit is that Wales has hired someone who has no human rights experience and very recently was working in an Israeli government-linked propaganda shop (which is, at best, a bad look given his public face as a champion of free and unbiased information). Her advice on the UAE, given what we know about her political-connections, would probably be along the lines of "they aren't so bad, the alternatives are worse, it's a rough neighborhood and stop being so naive." That should suit everyone right down to the ground.

Adding. Just brilliant.

In 2009, Orit was selected to be a part of the StandWithUs Fellowship program, in cooperation with the Israeli Ministry of Foreign Affairs, that aims to empower young Israeli adults to be informed, active, articulate, and globally-minded future leaders. Since then, she has been a part of StandWithUs as a speaker both in the United States and in Israel.

The Adversary · Unread post by **The Adversary** » Wed Jan 21, 2015 2:43 pm

She appears amazingly young and inexperienced, IMO.
<edit>

eagle wrote:The underlying point of this thread is that the prize was designed to "buy friends and influence people." If it had been awarded to the WMF in recognition of its contribution to the dissemination of world knowledge, it would have paid a bunch of programmers in San Francisco without earning much gratitude toward the UAE. But by giving the money to Mr. Wales personally, he can "buy" the friendship and loyalty of some A-list Israeli lawyer which will buy further good will in the inner circles of the politically connected to the benefit of both Mr. Wales and the UAE. So, the charitable mission which inspired the award is not furthered and human rights are not furthered, but Mr. Wales' nest is feathered.

Yeah, but recall that Jimbo is very small fry to Rashid Al Maktoum.

Watch the Ascot races, the two sure person in the Royal Box are Rashid Al Maktoum and his junior wife (daughter of the late king of Jordan). And then their huge entourage. Oh, by the way, his horses have won quite a few of the races.

I bet Jimbo would just love to move in the same circles.

thekohser · Unread post by **thekohser** » Wed Jan 21, 2015 4:06 pm

DanMurphy wrote:Just brilliant.

Israel Defense Forces combat field medic, Orit Kapel...

How common is it for young people to be skilled in law, medicine, human rights, and public relations? Did she get resume-building tips from Durova in San Diego, maybe?

Did anyone grab a screen shot of her LinkedIn page? Because it's gone now. The Wikipediocracy Effect.
(Sorry, her UK LinkedIn page is gone, but not the root LinkedIn page.)

Unread post by **tarantino** » Wed Jan 21, 2015 5:17 pm

The Adversary wrote:And here she is pictured with Israeli President Shimon Peres.

Wikimedia Israel chairman Itzik Edri is the director of government relationships at Debby Communications, where he manages the digital presence and social networking for Shimon Peres.

Unread post by **HRIP7** » Wed Jan 21, 2015 5:21 pm

tarantino wrote:
The Adversary wrote:And here she is pictured with Israeli President Shimon Peres.
Wikimedia Israel chairman Itzik Edri is the director of government relationships at Debby Communications, where he manages the digital presence and social networking for Shimon Peres.

Maybe that explains why she liked that Wikimedia Israel post.

Given that most freedom-of-speech suppression in the UAE is directed at Muslims, a Muslim human rights lawyer might have been a better fit.

DanMurphy · Unread post by **DanMurphy** » Wed Jan 21, 2015 5:50 pm

HRIP7 wrote:
tarantino wrote:
The Adversary wrote:And here she is pictured with Israeli President Shimon Peres.
Wikimedia Israel chairman Itzik Edri is the director of government relationships at Debby Communications, where he manages the digital presence and social networking for Shimon Peres.
Maybe that explains why she liked that Wikimedia Israel post.

Given that most freedom-of-speech suppression in the UAE is directed at Muslims, a Muslim human rights lawyer might have been a better fit.

Is there a Wikimedia "chapter" that isn't run by a PR guy? Mr. Edri was previously Tzipi Livni's flack, before that a flack for the Kadima Party.

The Adversary · Unread post by **The Adversary** » Wed Jan 21, 2015 6:00 pm

HRIP7 wrote:Given that most freedom-of-speech suppression in the UAE is directed at Muslims, a Muslim human rights lawyer might have been a better fit.

Quite.
He walked on a mine, taking money from an Arab dictator. To disengage from it, he walked so far as to step on....... another mine.

Hey, Jimbo, the way to manoeuvre in a mine-field (as the Middle-East) is not to step on each and every mine there is!

I wonder what will Jimbos reaction be, if Israel is condemned in the International Criminal Court (T-H-L), for exactly the things that his "human rights lawyer" (Hah!) has defended?

Unread post by **HRIP7** » Wed Jan 21, 2015 6:27 pm

Look at all those attendees at Peres' 2011 Presidential Conference:

I just returned from day one of the 3rd annual Presidential Conference in Jerusalem. The first day certainly had its fair share of notable names at the event – pop Diva and child education activist Shakira, Jewish comedian Sarah Silverman, Wikipedia founder Jimmy Wales, former UK Prime Minister Tony Blair, French Philosopher ...

David Shay, Wikimedia Israel reports, was an invitee at the most recent (post-Peres) Presidential Conference.

The list of leading editors of the Shimon Peres biography in the Hebrew Wikipedia is here.

David Shay is in third place, Liron Dorfman (another Wikimedia Israel member) in first.

Unread post by **HRIP7** » Wed Jan 21, 2015 6:50 pm

DanMurphy wrote:Is there a Wikimedia "chapter" that isn't run by a PR guy?

Well there is Wikimedia Norway, whose vice-chairman is the vice-president of the Telenor Group ...

At any rate, the Jimmy Wales Foundation now has a Twitter account, complete with an image from the Maurice Lacroix advertising campaign.

thekohser · Unread post by **thekohser** » Wed Jan 21, 2015 8:29 pm

HRIP7 wrote:At any rate, the Jimmy Wales Foundation now has a Twitter account...

Hopefully, Decision Analyst, Inc. will sue them over their logo.

Vigilant · Unread post by **Vigilant** » Wed Jan 21, 2015 11:57 pm

:snort:

Sure. We are nearly done with the filing documents to register the organization formally. We are engaging in a series of meetings and conversations with existing NGOs in this space as well as with activists who have been arrested and/or imprisoned for political speech, in order to better understand directly from the victim's perspective what gaps there are in current efforts in this area. We have been working as well on fundraising strategy as I'd like to multiply by many times the impact of this original funding. We have been working on setting up the website - boring I know, but these things do take time. As no actual money has been paid from the prize yet, there is currently only one full-time employee (CEO Orit Kopel, human rights lawyer). This does appear to be turning "into a longer term thing," though as I am getting encouraging support from various people and places.
In general, I don't expect to give regular updates here once the website launches- better to just read the news there. But I'm happy to answer questions here in the meantime.--Jimbo Wales (talk) 18:44, 20 January 2015 (UTC)

Longer term thing?!
Does that mean she'll be selling your Tshirts on eBay soon?

SB_Johnny · Unread post by **SB_Johnny** » Thu Jan 22, 2015 12:17 am

The Adversary wrote:He walked on a mine, taking money from an Arab dictator. To disengage from it, he walked so far as to step on....... another mine.

Hey, Jimbo, the way to manoeuvre in a mine-field (as the Middle-East) is not to step on each and every mine there is!

He's going to have an interesting life trying not to say the wrong thing now that he's stupidly entered that world. Boy's well beyond his depth.

Vigilant · Unread post by **Vigilant** » Thu Jan 22, 2015 3:06 am

SB_Johnny wrote:
The Adversary wrote:He walked on a mine, taking money from an Arab dictator. To disengage from it, he walked so far as to step on....... another mine.

Hey, Jimbo, the way to manoeuvre in a mine-field (as the Middle-East) is not to step on each and every mine there is!
He's going to have an interesting life trying not to say the wrong thing now that he's stupidly entered that world. Boy's well beyond his depth.

If he has an ounce of sense, he'll never mention it again and refer all questions to his "human rights lawyer"...

Here's to hoping he doesn't.

Anthonyhcole · Unread post by **Anthonyhcole** » Thu Jan 22, 2015 5:27 pm

Did the Kazakhstan government shill ever get his "Wikipedian of the year" money?

Vigilant · Unread post by **Vigilant** » Thu Jan 22, 2015 5:33 pm

Vigilant wrote:
SB_Johnny wrote:
The Adversary wrote:He walked on a mine, taking money from an Arab dictator. To disengage from it, he walked so far as to step on....... another mine.

Hey, Jimbo, the way to manoeuvre in a mine-field (as the Middle-East) is not to step on each and every mine there is!
He's going to have an interesting life trying not to say the wrong thing now that he's stupidly entered that world. Boy's well beyond his depth.
If he has an ounce of sense, he'll never mention it again and refer all questions to his "human rights lawyer"...

Here's to hoping he doesn't have that ounce.

Notvelty · Unread post by **Notvelty** » Fri Jan 23, 2015 12:12 am

Vigilant wrote:
Vigilant wrote:
SB_Johnny wrote:
The Adversary wrote:He walked on a mine, taking money from an Arab dictator. To disengage from it, he walked so far as to step on....... another mine.

Hey, Jimbo, the way to manoeuvre in a mine-field (as the Middle-East) is not to step on each and every mine there is!
He's going to have an interesting life trying not to say the wrong thing now that he's stupidly entered that world. Boy's well beyond his depth.
If he has an ounce of sense, he'll never mention it again and refer all questions to his "human rights lawyer"...

Here's to hoping he doesn't have that ounce.

I looked up "Ounce" on Wikipedia. I think I've discovered what the people who design open source, standard communications protocols did before computers.

Unread post by **HRIP7** » Fri Jan 23, 2015 2:49 am

thekohser wrote:You'd want to add that Joseph Nye is the "Sultan of Oman professor of international relations" at Harvard; and that Jimbo performed his "lecture" routine for the Sultan, before receiving his prize of the the 2014 edition of Sultan Qaboos Award for Excellence.

Being a keynote speaker for events organised by the Oman Ministry of Commerce and Industry is another thing Blair and Wales seem to have in common ...

(As was previously mentioned in this thread.)

The Adversary · Unread post by **The Adversary** » Sun Jan 25, 2015 9:22 pm

DanMurphy wrote: Adding. Just brilliant.
In 2009, Orit was selected to be a part of the StandWithUs Fellowship program, in cooperation with the Israeli Ministry of Foreign Affairs, that aims to empower young Israeli adults to be informed, active, articulate, and globally-minded future leaders. Since then, she has been a part of StandWithUs as a speaker both in the United States and in Israel.

Orit Kopel toured the US with this show: The suicide-bombing she refers to is Maxim restaurant suicide bombing (T-H-L), done by ms. Hanadi Jaradat (T-H-L).

Orit Kopel gives a very saccharine story about how she treated the brother who had sent ms. Hanadi into a suicide mission which killed 21 Israelis. Alas, Hanadi Jaradat was not, AFAIK; sent by anyone, she had seen her fiancé, her brother and her cousin killed by the Israeli army. This Haaretz-article pretty much sums it up. Her oldest surviving brother was more than 10 years her junior, and non of her brothers are named "Khaled" as Orit Kopel says in the video.

Ms. Hanadi Jaradat (T-H-L) has become famous as an example of "terrorists are not born, they are made". It is generally accepted that it was the killing of her brother and cousin in full view of her, that traumatised her so much she became a suicide bomber (and not a lawyer, which had been the plan).

So yeah, you could say her brother made her do it. Her dead brother. She was 29 when she died. Her only surviving brothers were Ahad, aged 16, and Tha'er, aged 15.

But then, who the heck is this "Khaled Jaradat" Orit talks about? There is "Khaled Jaradat", from the same village as Hanadi Jaradat, who has been going in and out of Israeli jails for years, alway on administrative detention; that is they can lock you up 6 months at a time. He has, AFAIK, never been actually sentenced for anything. And Amnesty has taken up his case.

He was in arrested in 1988, 1997, and was still in jail in 2001, according to this UN document. According to B'Tselem (T-H-L), 1997, "In the administrative detention of Khaled Jaradat, for example, the GSS confirmed that he was not suspected of being involved in any violent activity." We do not know when he was freed.

Jimbo wrote here

We are engaging in a series of meetings and conversations with existing NGOs in this space as well as with activists who have been arrested and/or imprisoned for political speech, in order to better understand directly from the victim's perspective what gaps there are in current efforts in this area.

...hmm.
And he hires Orit Kopel??

DanMurphy · Unread post by **DanMurphy** » Sun Jan 25, 2015 9:28 pm

The Adversary wrote:
DanMurphy wrote: Adding. Just brilliant.
In 2009, Orit was selected to be a part of the StandWithUs Fellowship program, in cooperation with the Israeli Ministry of Foreign Affairs, that aims to empower young Israeli adults to be informed, active, articulate, and globally-minded future leaders. Since then, she has been a part of StandWithUs as a speaker both in the United States and in Israel.
Orit Kopel toured the US with this show: The suicide-bombing she refers to is Maxim restaurant suicide bombing (T-H-L), done by ms. Hanadi Jaradat (T-H-L).

Orit Kopel gives a very saccharine story about how she treated the brother who had sent ms. Hanadi into a suicide mission which killed 21 Israelis. Alas, Hanadi Jaradat was not, AFAIK; sent by anyone, she had seen her fiancé, her brother and her cousin killed by the Israeli army. This Haaretz-article pretty much sums it up. Her oldest surviving brother was more than 10 years her junior, and non of her brothers are named "Khaled" as Orit Kopel says in the video.

Hanadi Jaradat (T-H-L) has become famous as an example of "terrorists are not born, they are made". It is generally accepted that it was the killing of her brother and cousin in full view of her, that traumatised her so much she became a suicide bomber (and not a lawyer, which had been the plan).

So yeah, you could say her brother made her do it. Her dead brother. She was 29 when she died. Her only surviving brothers were Ahad, aged 16, and Tha'er, aged 15.

But then, who the heck is this "Khaled Jaradat" Orit talks about? There is "Khaled Jaradat", from the same village as Hanadi Jaradat, who has been going in and out of Israeli jails for years, alway on administrative detention; that is they can lock you up 6 months at a time. He has, AFAIK, never been actually sentenced for anything. And Amnesty has taken up his case.

He was in arrested in 1988, 1997, and was still in jail in 2001, according to this UN document. According to B'Tselem (T-H-L), 1997, "In the administrative detention of Khaled Jaradat, for example, the GSS confirmed that he was not suspected of being involved in any violent activity. One of the reasons given in Jamal Ahmad's administrative detention order is that he "incites against the peace process." Such usage is a blatant contradiction of the right to freedom of speech and freedom of opinion guaranteed under international law. If these same standards were applied inside Israel, half of the Likud party would be in administrative detention." We do not know when he was freed.

Jimbo wrote here
We are engaging in a series of meetings and conversations with existing NGOs in this space as well as with activists who have been arrested and/or imprisoned for political speech, in order to better understand directly from the victim's perspective what gaps there are in current efforts in this area.
...hmm.
And he hires Orit Kopel??

Are you saying that Ms. Kopel has fabricated her claim of treating a brother of Jaradat? That's good stuff, if true.

As for "not sent by anyone." Well, motivations are one thing. But first timers don't make bombs that effective. The chance she acted completely alone are as close as you can get to zero.

ADDING: Ah, never mind. She never claimed the guy was hurt in the bombing in Haifa (I remembered incorrectly). It's just that she asserts that the "terrorist" Khaled was responsible for the Maxim bombing. Which is at best unproven. And it doesn't appear he's her brother. I'm sure Ms. Kopel believed everything she said on that dog and pony tour. Why not? It all conformed with her world-view and biases.

Digging too deep into this can lead us down to fights over Israel and Palestine. But the stupidity, and the complete lack of due diligence from Wales here is, well, pretty much par for the course.

The Adversary · Unread post by **The Adversary** » Sun Jan 25, 2015 9:40 pm

DanMurphy wrote: Are you saying that Ms. Kopel has fabricated her claim of treating a brother of Jaradat? That's good stuff, if true.

As for "not sent by anyone." Well, motivations are one thing. But first timers don't make bombs that effective. The chance she acted completely alone are as close as you can get to zero.

Jaradat did not have a brother named Khaled (as Ms. Kopel claims), and her only (surviving ) brothers were more than 10 years her junior.

There are several "Khaled Jaradat" arrested by the Israelis; we cannot know which one Ms. Kopel speaks about. But my guess is that it was the "Khaled Jaradat" from Silat al-Harithiya (T-H-L), the same village as Ms. Jaradat came from. From what I can find: he had been in jail on unrelated charges for years when Ms. Jaradat blew herself up.

I agree about getting help from someone; but who that was has never been published AFAIK.
<edit>
About the Jaradat-family, read the Haaretz-article.

Notvelty · Unread post by **Notvelty** » Sun Jan 25, 2015 11:46 pm

Sure. And then, for balance, I'll read the coverage in "Zionism Is Great Monthly".

Unread post by **HRIP7** » Wed Jan 28, 2015 2:03 pm

A conversation on Quora.

Jimmy Wales
Deeply dishonest of you to pretend that I accepted the prize money for myself, rather than accepting it on the condition that it go to fighting for freedom of speech. Not one penny for me.
Upvote • Downvote • Share • Report • 1h ago

Andreas Kolbe
Are you saying that the UAE government attached a condition to the award that you (and Sir Tim Berners-Lee) must not spend it on anything but human rights work?

Incidentally, William Beutler has claimed in Jimmy Wales and the Terrible, Horrible, No Good, Very Bad Prize Money (Page on archive.today) that when Wikipedians congratulated you on the award ...

Wales’ first reply on his own discussion page was:
Thank you all. It’s pretty amazing. It’s actually split with Sir Tim Berners-Lee so not $1 million to me but still it’s impressive.

(User talk:Jimbo Wales: Difference between revisions, Page on archive.today)

Incidentally, did you receive payment for the keynote speech in Oman, and if so, would you say how much?

DanMurphy · Unread post by **DanMurphy** » Wed Jan 28, 2015 2:33 pm

Ask him if he thinks it's a smart move to put someone on Israel's Hasbara payroll in charge of advocating for human rights in the middle east?

I mean, OF COURSE he was going to pocket the money before people noticed how unsavory his participation in a PR exercise for a dictator was. But that can't be proven.

I suspect Mr. Wales' new "foundation" will be covering travel expenses for some of Wales "charity work" in the not too distant future, and that will be about it. I don't think people will be lining up to fund "Jimmy Wales' school for dictatorships that don't do human rights good and other stuff" for him.

Vigilant · Unread post by **Vigilant** » Wed Jan 28, 2015 4:41 pm

DanMurphy wrote:Ask him if he thinks it's a smart move to put someone on Israel's Hasbara payroll in charge of advocating for human rights in the middle east?

I mean, OF COURSE he was going to pocket the money before people noticed how unsavory his participation in a PR exercise for a dictator was. But that can't be proven.

I suspect Mr. Wales' new "foundation" will be covering travel expenses for some of Wales "charity work" in the not too distant future, and that will be about it. I don't think people will be lining up to fund "Jimmy Wales' school for dictatorships that don't do human rights good and other stuff" for him.

$500K will buy a LOT of Russian massage parlor trips, even when splitting it with a shyster lawyer.

thekohser · Unread post by **thekohser** » Wed Jan 28, 2015 5:34 pm

Is anyone else disgusted by how Jimmy presents his after-the-fact intentions as if they were before-the-fact?

The Adversary · Unread post by **The Adversary** » Wed Jan 28, 2015 5:41 pm

thekohser wrote:Is anyone else disgusted by how Jimmy presents his after-the-fact intentions as if they were before-the-fact?

Well, nothing new in that, is it?
Jimbo has always been making up the past as he goes along.

Vigilant · Unread post by **Vigilant** » Wed Jan 28, 2015 5:56 pm

thekohser wrote:Is anyone else disgusted by how Jimmy presents his after-the-fact intentions as if they were before-the-fact?

You just don't understand him...

He is looking at the world without time.

mac · Unread post by **mac** » Wed Jan 28, 2015 9:56 pm

Vigilant wrote:
DanMurphy wrote:Ask him if he thinks it's a smart move to put someone on Israel's Hasbara payroll in charge of advocating for human rights in the middle east?

I mean, OF COURSE he was going to pocket the money before people noticed how unsavory his participation in a PR exercise for a dictator was. But that can't be proven.

I suspect Mr. Wales' new "foundation" will be covering travel expenses for some of Wales "charity work" in the not too distant future, and that will be about it. I don't think people will be lining up to fund "Jimmy Wales' school for dictatorships that don't do human rights good and other stuff" for him.
$500K will buy a LOT of Russian massage parlor trips, even when splitting it with a shyster lawyer.

Even if Wales himself doesn't get one penny of the money (lol), there are plenty of sinecures that can be handed out. If he was truly concerned about human rights, he could have donated the funds to an established organization with a proven track record. The whole thing stinks.

Poetlister · Unread post by **Poetlister** » Wed Jan 28, 2015 9:57 pm

DanMurphy wrote:Ask him if he thinks it's a smart move to put someone on Israel's Hasbara payroll in charge of advocating for human rights in the middle east?

Which other Middle Eastern country has much respect for human rights? Saudi Arabia? Iran? Oh, of course, Dubai.

Unread post by **Midsize Jake** » Thu Jan 29, 2015 1:18 am

neved wrote:Wales never publicly said: "I've haired an Israeli to help me with my charity on human rights."
He simply responded a question, and provided the name of a person he has hired.

What difference does it make if he didn't point out that she's an Israeli national in the response...?

So how did you come up with the conclusion that Wales haired an Israeli "to promote Israel, and to make its regional enemies look bad".

He didn't; read the post again. He merely pointed out that an Israeli who was once a paid staffer/operative in one of Israel's international outreach programs wasn't a good choice for this particular job, at least not from a PR perspective. It doesn't mean she isn't qualified for it, and it's even possible she'd be completely unbiased, but the latter seems rather unlikely.

DanMurphy · Unread post by **DanMurphy** » Thu Jan 29, 2015 1:25 am

mac wrote:
Vigilant wrote:
DanMurphy wrote:Ask him if he thinks it's a smart move to put someone on Israel's Hasbara payroll in charge of advocating for human rights in the middle east?

I mean, OF COURSE he was going to pocket the money before people noticed how unsavory his participation in a PR exercise for a dictator was. But that can't be proven.

I suspect Mr. Wales' new "foundation" will be covering travel expenses for some of Wales "charity work" in the not too distant future, and that will be about it. I don't think people will be lining up to fund "Jimmy Wales' school for dictatorships that don't do human rights good and other stuff" for him.
$500K will buy a LOT of Russian massage parlor trips, even when splitting it with a shyster lawyer.
Even if Wales himself doesn't get one penny of the money (lol), there are plenty of sinecures that can be handed out. If he was truly concerned about human rights, he could have donated the funds to an established organization with a proven track record. The whole thing stinks.

Bingo.

neved · Unread post by **neved** » Thu Jan 29, 2015 1:30 am

mac wrote: Even if Wales himself doesn't get one penny of the money (lol), there are plenty of sinecures that can be handed out. If he was truly concerned about human rights, he could have donated the funds to an established organization with a proven track record. The whole thing stinks.

Yes, I also believe that it would have looked much better, if Wales donated the money to an established charity.

Unread post by **Zoloft** » Thu Jan 29, 2015 4:02 am

*looks around*

Man this topic is just a pile of garbage now.

I usually just slide all this stuff in the garbage pail, but I feel y'all are heavily invested in this, so splitting it to off-topic seems right. Wait right here.

Edit: Done. Your arguing and other claptrap is here: link viewtopic.php?f=4&t=5972[/link]

Please, go back to the award, and how Jimbo is going to fuck it up. Thank you!

Anthonyhcole · Unread post by **Anthonyhcole** » Fri Jan 30, 2015 3:33 am

mac wrote:Even if Wales himself doesn't get one penny of the money (lol), there are plenty of sinecures that can be handed out.

If he spends the principal, he can employ a few people for a few years. If he creates an endowment fund, the earnings will barely cover the cost of one part-time expert.

mac wrote: If he was truly concerned about human rights, he could have donated the funds to an established organization with a proven track record. The whole thing stinks.

Yep. It's about being a patron.

Jim · Unread post by **Jim** » Fri Jan 30, 2015 4:01 am

Anthonyhcole wrote:
mac wrote: If he was truly concerned about human rights, he could have donated the funds to an established organization with a proven track record. The whole thing stinks.
Yep. It's about being a patron.

I thought it was about retaining the greatest possible control of the loot, while attempting to appease critics, no?

Unread post by **Midsize Jake** » Fri Jan 30, 2015 7:34 am

Jim wrote:I thought it was about retaining the greatest possible control of the loot, while attempting to appease critics, no?

Sure, but based on what Jimbo has been banging on about for the last 3 years or so, "human rights" is synonymous with "being allowed to publish whatever you want without yourself being subjected to warrantless electronic surveillance." (Or criticism, but that's a given with Jimbo.) He's not interested in nameless, faceless dissident reformers rotting away in the jail cells of repressive regimes; he's interested in people like Aaron Swartz and Edward Snowden.

In effect, he's rolling the dice, based on the idea that his own name-recognition and circle of friends will allow him to become a big-time player in the free-expression movement or the protect-whistleblowers movement whatever it happens to be this week. He wants influence, and he wants to be out front - so it's not entirely inconceivable that he's been wanting to do something like this for a while now, even since before the UAE money came along.

And to be fair, it might actually work - he's well-known enough to get people like Larry, Sergei, Zuckerberg, maybe even Bill Gates to respond to his e-mails, and for those guys a few million dollars is the kind of money they lose in the couch cushions without ever noticing it. The only question is whether or not they're familiar enough with Jimbo to know about his problems with honesty and not following through on things.

Vigilant · Unread post by **Vigilant** » Fri Jan 30, 2015 7:46 am

Midsize Jake wrote:
Jim wrote:I thought it was about retaining the greatest possible control of the loot, while attempting to appease critics, no?
Sure, but based on what Jimbo has been banging on about for the last 3 years or so, "human rights" is synonymous with "being allowed to publish whatever you want without yourself being subjected to warrantless electronic surveillance." (Or criticism, but that's a given with Jimbo.) He's not interested in nameless, faceless dissident reformers rotting away in the jail cells of repressive regimes; he's interested in people like Aaron Swartz and Edward Snowden.

In effect, he's rolling the dice, based on the idea that his own name-recognition and circle of friends will allow him to become a big-time player in the free-expression movement or the protect-whistleblowers movement whatever it happens to be this week. He wants influence, and he wants to be out front - so it's not entirely inconceivable that he's been wanting to do something like this for a while now, even since before the UAE money came along.

And to be fair, it might actually work - he's well-known enough to get people like Larry, Sergei, Zuckerberg, maybe even Bill Gates to respond to his e-mails, and for those guys a few million dollars is the kind of money they lose in the couch cushions without ever noticing it. The only question is whether or not they're familiar enough with Jimbo to know about his problems with honesty and not following through on things.

I know one of these guys socially; they all know what Jimbo is.

Lukeno94 · Unread post by **Lukeno94** » Fri Jan 30, 2015 8:10 am

If Gates thought Jimbo's case was valid, he'd probably set up his own charity to fund exactly the same thing.

Unread post by **Midsize Jake** » Fri Jan 30, 2015 8:12 am

Vigilant wrote:I know one of these guys socially; they all know what Jimbo is.

Well, I never said he shouldn't quit while he's ahead.

Unread post by **HRIP7** » Fri Jan 30, 2015 8:55 am

Vigilant wrote:
Midsize Jake wrote:And to be fair, it might actually work - he's well-known enough to get people like Larry, Sergei, Zuckerberg, maybe even Bill Gates to respond to his e-mails, and for those guys a few million dollars is the kind of money they lose in the couch cushions without ever noticing it. The only question is whether or not they're familiar enough with Jimbo to know about his problems with honesty and not following through on things.
I know one of these guys socially; they all know what Jimbo is.

Doesn't the evidence – in Larry's and Sergei's case at least – suggest he is useful to them?