Deleted by Jimbo

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Re: Deleted by Jimbo

Unread post by thekohser » Wed Aug 07, 2013 2:38 pm

A couple of "hat note" quasi-deletions by Jimbo today:

http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?tit ... =567476474

http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?tit ... =567476338

Note that in the second one, Jimbo says "Socialtext no longer exists". That's weird -- they seem to be up and running and thriving.
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Re: Deleted by Jimbo

Unread post by HRIP7 » Wed Aug 07, 2013 3:46 pm

thekohser wrote:A couple of "hat note" quasi-deletions by Jimbo today:

http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?tit ... =567476474

http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?tit ... =567476338

Note that in the second one, Jimbo says "Socialtext no longer exists". That's weird -- they seem to be up and running and thriving.
Inquiry to me based on false claims. I do not sit on the board of Socialtext, and have not for many years. Socialtext no longer exists, and I don't know anyone at the company that acquired them. I haven't looked at the article but of course my view is that if it needs improvement, it should be improved.--Jimbo Wales (talk) 01:17, 7 August 2013 (UTC)
Someone should update his Wikipedia biography then. It says in the infobox that he is a board member of Socialtext.

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Re: Deleted by Jimbo

Unread post by dogbiscuit » Wed Aug 07, 2013 4:11 pm

HRIP7 wrote:
thekohser wrote:A couple of "hat note" quasi-deletions by Jimbo today:

http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?tit ... =567476474

http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?tit ... =567476338

Note that in the second one, Jimbo says "Socialtext no longer exists". That's weird -- they seem to be up and running and thriving.
Inquiry to me based on false claims. I do not sit on the board of Socialtext, and have not for many years. Socialtext no longer exists, and I don't know anyone at the company that acquired them. I haven't looked at the article but of course my view is that if it needs improvement, it should be improved.--Jimbo Wales (talk) 01:17, 7 August 2013 (UTC)
Someone should update his Wikipedia biography then. It says in the infobox that he is a board member of Socialtext.
...but Jimbo is not a reliable source, I think Wikipedians have already accepted that.
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Re: Deleted by Jimbo

Unread post by DanMurphy » Wed Aug 07, 2013 4:44 pm

dogbiscuit wrote:
HRIP7 wrote:
thekohser wrote:A couple of "hat note" quasi-deletions by Jimbo today:

http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?tit ... =567476474

http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?tit ... =567476338

Note that in the second one, Jimbo says "Socialtext no longer exists". That's weird -- they seem to be up and running and thriving.
Inquiry to me based on false claims. I do not sit on the board of Socialtext, and have not for many years. Socialtext no longer exists, and I don't know anyone at the company that acquired them. I haven't looked at the article but of course my view is that if it needs improvement, it should be improved.--Jimbo Wales (talk) 01:17, 7 August 2013 (UTC)
Someone should update his Wikipedia biography then. It says in the infobox that he is a board member of Socialtext.
...but Jimbo is not a reliable source, I think Wikipedians have already accepted that.
Wikipedia's article on the more famous of its two co-founders has had a straight error of fact in it for years, according to Jimmy Wales. How could this be?

I'm half minded to write a five graph post about this - contrasting it with his assurances about Wikipedia's thoughtful, wonderful, correction mechanisms.

The article about Wales is the English Wikipedia's 115th most watched article and its 25th most watched biographical article.

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Re: Deleted by Jimbo

Unread post by thekohser » Wed Aug 07, 2013 5:38 pm

DanMurphy wrote:Wikipedia's article on the more famous of its two co-founders has had a straight error of fact in it for years, according to Jimmy Wales. How could this be?

I'm half minded to write a five graph post about this - contrasting it with his assurances about Wikipedia's thoughtful, wonderful, correction mechanisms.

The article about Wales is the English Wikipedia's 115th most watched article and its 25th most watched biographical article.
Hit it, Dan. Make it happen!
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Re: Deleted by Jimbo

Unread post by Smiley » Wed Aug 07, 2013 6:14 pm

Dan Murphy wrote:The article about Wales is the English Wikipedia's 115th most watched article and its 25th most watched biographical article.
I recently asked MZMcBride (T-C-L) for a list of the least watched BLPs..


No response yet.

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Re: Deleted by Jimbo

Unread post by SB_Johnny » Thu Aug 08, 2013 12:15 am

Smiley wrote:
Dan Murphy wrote:The article about Wales is the English Wikipedia's 115th most watched article and its 25th most watched biographical article.
I recently asked MZMcBride (T-C-L) for a list of the least watched BLPs..


No response yet.
There's a story behind that...
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Re: Deleted by Jimbo

Unread post by HRIP7 » Thu Aug 08, 2013 12:32 am

thekohser wrote:
DanMurphy wrote:Wikipedia's article on the more famous of its two co-founders has had a straight error of fact in it for years, according to Jimmy Wales. How could this be?

I'm half minded to write a five graph post about this - contrasting it with his assurances about Wikipedia's thoughtful, wonderful, correction mechanisms.

The article about Wales is the English Wikipedia's 115th most watched article and its 25th most watched biographical article.
Hit it, Dan. Make it happen!
+1

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Re: Deleted by Jimbo

Unread post by thekohser » Thu Aug 08, 2013 1:09 am

SB_Johnny wrote:
Smiley wrote:
Dan Murphy wrote:The article about Wales is the English Wikipedia's 115th most watched article and its 25th most watched biographical article.
I recently asked MZMcBride (T-C-L) for a list of the least watched BLPs..


No response yet.
There's a story behind that...
Yeah -- a big one. The story being an experiment I did, where MZ gave me a list of unwatched BLPs that had no sources, and I added bogus information to them, using sources that discussed someone having the same name as the subject, but was not the subject. (Example)

Unfortunately, too much was revealed publicly about the experiment before it commenced, leading to my being caught after a few days. Had the experiment not been disclosed in advance, I'm quite sure that 80% or more of the bogus edits would have stuck in Wikipedia for the proposed 3-month test period.

(Incidentally, because my sockpuppets were identified by this breaching experiment, an admin account (of mine / purported to be mine) was also identified, desysopped, and banned.)
"...making nonsensical connections and culminating in feigned surprise, since 2006..."

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Re: Deleted by Jimbo

Unread post by SB_Johnny » Thu Aug 08, 2013 1:13 am

thekohser wrote:
SB_Johnny wrote:
Smiley wrote:
Dan Murphy wrote:The article about Wales is the English Wikipedia's 115th most watched article and its 25th most watched biographical article.
I recently asked MZMcBride (T-C-L) for a list of the least watched BLPs..


No response yet.
There's a story behind that...
Yeah -- a big one. The story being an experiment I did, where MZ gave me a list of unwatched BLPs that had no sources, and I added bogus information to them, using sources that discussed someone having the same name as the subject, but was not the subject. (Example)

Unfortunately, too much was revealed publicly about the experiment before it commenced, leading to my being caught after a few days. Had the experiment not been disclosed in advance, I'm quite sure that 80% or more of the bogus edits would have stuck in Wikipedia for the proposed 3-month test period.

(Incidentally, because my sockpuppets were identified by this breaching experiment, an admin account (of mine / purported to be mine) was also identified, desysopped, and banned.)
...and as a result MZ was drama-tarred and drama-feathered, then wiki-dragged through the wiki-streets, before the cheering crowds of the faithful and their sockpuppets.

So, you probably aren't going to get any help from him.
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Re: Deleted by Jimbo

Unread post by Smiley » Thu Aug 08, 2013 1:39 am

thekohser wrote:..an experiment I did, where MZ gave me a list of unwatched BLPs that had no sources, and I added bogus information to them, using sources that discussed someone having the same name as the subject, but was not the subject. (Example)
Unwatched? I knew straight away who that was!

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Re: Deleted by Jimbo

Unread post by Poetlister » Thu Aug 08, 2013 11:41 am

Smiley wrote:
Dan Murphy wrote:The article about Wales is the English Wikipedia's 115th most watched article and its 25th most watched biographical article.
I recently asked MZMcBride (T-C-L) for a list of the least watched BLPs..


No response yet.
The trouble with that is that an article may be allegedly watched by several editors, but if they're all blocked or have abandoned Wikipedia for other reasons, it is effectively unwatched. Even MZ can't give you a list of those BLPs.
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Re: Deleted by Jimbo

Unread post by HRIP7 » Sun Aug 18, 2013 4:05 pm

Delicious carbuncle wrote:== Commons is still pining over Beta M ==

Jimbo, I thought you might be interested in this [http://commons.wikimedia.org/w/index.ph ... =102120295 recent invocation of your name] on Commons, in a vote about a particular user from COM:AN:{{quote|1='''Btw, [[User:Beta_M|Beta_M]], a productive and mellow user, is still globally banned by Jimmy and his WMF; whereas the account "Penyulap", whose entire contribution to Commons seems to be to inflammate in every possible discussion, still has a ''carte blanche'' for trolling on Commons. I wonder, then - where is the justice?'''}}That statement was made by [[User:A.Savin]], who is a Commons admin. I'm sure you remember Beta M (but probably not because he was mellow and productive). [[User:Delicious carbuncle|Delicious carbuncle]] ([[User talk:Delicious carbuncle|talk]]) 23:50, 17 August 2013 (UTC)
Deleted with edit summary,
Jimbo Wales wrote:I don't see anything productive coming from a discussion of this form, I'm afraid.

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Re: Deleted by Jimbo

Unread post by EricBarbour » Sun Aug 18, 2013 10:24 pm

Dan Murphy wrote:The article about Wales is the English Wikipedia's 115th most watched article and its 25th most watched biographical article.
Those database reports are very, very weird sometimes. I can understand why most of them are highly-placed on the list.....
For example, why is Little Barrier Island (T-H-L) being watched by 3,933 people??

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Re: Deleted by Jimbo

Unread post by Jaranda » Sun Aug 18, 2013 11:46 pm

EricBarbour wrote:
Dan Murphy wrote:The article about Wales is the English Wikipedia's 115th most watched article and its 25th most watched biographical article.
Those database reports are very, very weird sometimes. I can understand why most of them are highly-placed on the list.....
For example, why is Little Barrier Island (T-H-L) being watched by 3,933 people??
http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?tit ... view_log=1

Old Main Page move mistake from 2005, and when an article gets moved both the target and the redirect left behind are watchlisted. Apparently there are 3,933 inactive users who had the Main Page in their watchlist when the change occurred and still have it now.

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Re: Deleted by Jimbo

Unread post by EricBarbour » Mon Aug 19, 2013 3:05 am

Jaranda wrote:http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?tit ... view_log=1

Old Main Page move mistake from 2005, and when an article gets moved both the target and the redirect left behind are watchlisted. Apparently there are 3,933 inactive users who had the Main Page in their watchlist when the change occurred and still have it now.
And no one notices or repairs it. How many other page-move errors are there the database? Thousands? Millions?

Remember Willy on Wheels? Most of his "sneaky vandalism" was done via page moves. Grawp learned to use
that trick by observing Willy. I see that they still haven't repaired this major MediaWiki problem.

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Re: Deleted by Jimbo

Unread post by EricBarbour » Mon Aug 19, 2013 4:06 am

I've gone over my records of Jimbo talkpage removals, and have compiled the following.

Prior to 2006: almost no instances of Wales silencing criticisms, which tended to be rare and usually incoherent anyway, thus were ignored.

2006: too chaotic, repeated instances of Wales directly modifying people's comments, and things being oversighted. The pedophilia userbox war was a major generator of "drama" on his talkpage for weeks. He oversighted a LOT of things.

2007: 7

2008: 6

2009: 6

2010: 13

2011: 5

2012: 16

2013: 17 to date

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Re: Deleted by Jimbo

Unread post by neved » Mon Sep 02, 2013 3:39 pm

"We can forgive the Arabs for killing our children. We cannot forgive them for forcing us to kill their children." Golda Meir

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Re: Deleted by Jimbo

Unread post by Hex » Mon Sep 02, 2013 4:36 pm

My question, to this esteemed Wiki community, is this: Do you think that a Wiki could successfully generate a useful encyclopedia? -- JimboWales
Yes, but in the end it wouldn't be an encyclopedia. It would be a wiki. -- WardCunningham (Jan 2001)

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Re: Deleted by Jimbo

Unread post by Wer900 » Mon Sep 02, 2013 5:07 pm

Funny that Beebs gave multiple fish to me a year ago while claiming to speak for "Wikipedia", stating that Wikipedia had no "politics", and that "we do not need or desire a formal governmental structure" because of our holy policies of NOTDEM and NOTBURO and is now loudly bleating on AN/I that I am "harassing" him by bringing him up as an abusive administrator. If Beeblebrox's attempt to get me indefinitely blocked fails (as looks likely now), and I trout him for his gross error of judgment, he will merely continue going after me. But I don't use trouts, not even on people like Beeblebrox.
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Re: Deleted by Jimbo

Unread post by Hex » Tue Sep 03, 2013 12:17 pm

Trouts are a legacy of IRC "culture", anyway, which is another reason why they should be taken out back, put in a barrel and shot. (Image)
My question, to this esteemed Wiki community, is this: Do you think that a Wiki could successfully generate a useful encyclopedia? -- JimboWales
Yes, but in the end it wouldn't be an encyclopedia. It would be a wiki. -- WardCunningham (Jan 2001)

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Re: Deleted by Jimbo

Unread post by Wer900 » Wed Sep 04, 2013 4:44 am

Hex wrote:Trouts are a legacy of IRC "culture", anyway, which is another reason why they should be taken out back, put in a barrel and shot. (Image)
Not like trouts are conducive to reasoned argument, anyway.
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Re: Deleted by Jimbo

Unread post by Hex » Fri Sep 13, 2013 3:39 am

My question, to this esteemed Wiki community, is this: Do you think that a Wiki could successfully generate a useful encyclopedia? -- JimboWales
Yes, but in the end it wouldn't be an encyclopedia. It would be a wiki. -- WardCunningham (Jan 2001)

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Re: Deleted by Jimbo

Unread post by Wer900 » Fri Sep 13, 2013 3:43 am

Good Lord. Congratulations, Jimbo, you have affirmed that Wikipedia is not an encyclopedia, but rather a "community kitchen"! I wonder what's cooking... :evilgrin:
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Re: Deleted by Jimbo

Unread post by HRIP7 » Fri Sep 13, 2013 4:22 pm

Cute. Here is the equally cute continuation of the discussion between Wales and Austin Knight on AustinKnight (T-C-L)'s talk page.

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Re: Deleted by Jimbo

Unread post by rhindle » Sat Sep 14, 2013 1:54 am

HRIP7 wrote:
Cute. Here is the equally cute continuation of the discussion between Wales and Austin Knight on AustinKnight (T-C-L)'s talk page.
Wyss, I've now stopped by your talk page and all I can think to say is "brilliant." Your exquisitely lucid comments re. what Wikipedia really is comprised of -- e.g., a mob-driven cultural meta blog pretending to be an encyclopedia, a user base that won't support an encyclopedia built on scholarly standards, a traffic-driven (vs. truth-driven) content model, loopy talk page discussions/scoldings, a cyber-waste dump of coddled trolls, fools and mob-think police, a fame game that is soon to be a code-word-for-trolls "meta-knowledge" site, an E-Bay of opinionated blogs, and, last but not least, too broken to fix and too fixed to break -- are all smack dead-on

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Re: Deleted by Jimbo

Unread post by Zoloft » Sat Sep 14, 2013 2:57 am

rhindle wrote:
HRIP7 wrote:
Cute. Here is the equally cute continuation of the discussion between Wales and Austin Knight on AustinKnight (T-C-L)'s talk page.
Wyss, I've now stopped by your talk page and all I can think to say is "brilliant." Your exquisitely lucid comments re. what Wikipedia really is comprised of -- e.g., a mob-driven cultural meta blog pretending to be an encyclopedia, a user base that won't support an encyclopedia built on scholarly standards, a traffic-driven (vs. truth-driven) content model, loopy talk page discussions/scoldings, a cyber-waste dump of coddled trolls, fools and mob-think police, a fame game that is soon to be a code-word-for-trolls "meta-knowledge" site, an E-Bay of opinionated blogs, and, last but not least, too broken to fix and too fixed to break -- are all smack dead-on
Keep reading down the page and it gets real stupid, and he's blocked for kinda sorta almost maybe threatening someone anonymous...

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Re: Deleted by Jimbo

Unread post by Peter Damian » Sat Sep 14, 2013 7:39 am

rhindle wrote:
HRIP7 wrote:
Cute. Here is the equally cute continuation of the discussion between Wales and Austin Knight on AustinKnight (T-C-L)'s talk page.
Wyss, I've now stopped by your talk page and all I can think to say is "brilliant." Your exquisitely lucid comments re. what Wikipedia really is comprised of -- e.g., a mob-driven cultural meta blog pretending to be an encyclopedia, a user base that won't support an encyclopedia built on scholarly standards, a traffic-driven (vs. truth-driven) content model, loopy talk page discussions/scoldings, a cyber-waste dump of coddled trolls, fools and mob-think police, a fame game that is soon to be a code-word-for-trolls "meta-knowledge" site, an E-Bay of opinionated blogs, and, last but not least, too broken to fix and too fixed to break -- are all smack dead-on
That whole dialogue is utterly brilliant.
If you emailed me something thoughtful, rather than bile and insults, then there is a very good chance you'll get a thoughtful response. But in the meantime, relax a notch or two and stop yelling at me, ok?--Jimbo Wales 00:22, 10 December 2005 (UTC)

Readers will note that Mr Wales responds to the presentation and tone of the editor's remarks, not the content. This evasiveness is systemic to Wikipedia and directly relates to why the overwhelming majority of its entries don't even come close to any notion of academic reliability and documented authority. Wyss 04:21, 10 December 2005 (UTC)
That systematic evasiveness, and the obsession with tone and presentation rather than content (plus the spurious and untruthful ‘thoughtful’) has it absolutely right.
οὐκ ἀγαθὸν πολυκοιρανίη: εἷς κοίρανος ἔστω

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Re: Deleted by Jimbo

Unread post by EricBarbour » Sat Sep 14, 2013 9:08 am

Peter Damian wrote:
Readers will note that Mr Wales responds to the presentation and tone of the editor's remarks, not the content. This evasiveness is systemic to Wikipedia and directly relates to why the overwhelming majority of its entries don't even come close to any notion of academic reliability and documented authority. Wyss 04:21, 10 December 2005 (UTC)
That systematic evasiveness, and the obsession with tone and presentation rather than content (plus the spurious and untruthful ‘thoughtful’) has it absolutely right.
And the ultimate joke: that was Heidi "Gwen Gale" Wyss. She later learned to imitate him.

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Re: Deleted by Jimbo

Unread post by thekohser » Thu Oct 17, 2013 10:22 pm

Jimbo's at it again...

"Fram is not welcome here, and has been warned more than once."
Discussing editors behind their back isn't very polite. Please drop a note at [[User talk:NCurse]] or at least ping: {{ping|NCurse}}. [[User:Fram|Fram]] ([[User talk:Fram|talk]]) 10:24, 10 October 2013 (UTC)
Poof!
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Re: Deleted by Jimbo

Unread post by EricBarbour » Thu Oct 17, 2013 11:19 pm

Interesting -- in the past year, Jimbotalk has started to resemble Swiss cheese. Huge pile of posts about Croatian Wikipedia,
and some unrelated items, were obliterated on 14-15 September. Plus other posts being rev-deleted. No explanation.

Fram has been deleting things too. Despite being "not welcome here".

It's never been this bad before.

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Re: Deleted by Jimbo

Unread post by thekohser » Thu Oct 31, 2013 3:29 am

A couple were spotted today.

Poof! (Looks like an edit conflict that Jimbo steamrolled over, because he can't be bothered to yield the floor and re-do his post.)

Poof! (Probably another edit conflict, but certainly this one is the sort of content that Jimbo loves to make go away.)
"...making nonsensical connections and culminating in feigned surprise, since 2006..."

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Re: Deleted by Jimbo

Unread post by EricBarbour » Fri Nov 01, 2013 2:56 am

thekohser wrote:Poof! (Looks like an edit conflict that Jimbo steamrolled over, because he can't be bothered to yield the floor and re-do his post.)
Mark Miller is evidently "unwelcome", because others are removing Mark's comments for Jimbo. And it was just edit-warred. Idiocy.
::::Jimbo deleted my post by accident, of that I am sure now. But, I was never assuming "bad faith" on his part. Just that either it was a mistaken deletion or he didn't approve of the edit (for whatever reason) and that if it was for the latter, he is always good enough to explain why. generaly he will hat, not delete. Also, considering I just did the exact same thing on AN, it is even clearer what happened.--[[User:Mark Miller|Mark Miller]] ([[User talk:Mark Miller|talk]]) 00:47, 1 November 2013 (UTC)

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Re: Deleted by Jimbo

Unread post by The Adversary » Fri Nov 01, 2013 9:13 am

Take a look at Alan Dershowitz (T-H-L):

if you look at the history, it looks as if the article was started in 2005 ...by Jimbo.
The logs do not reveal anything.

Alas, strangely, the talk-page goes back to 2003!

Jimbo "explained" it here:
I have received a very strong complaint about this article, and so I have protected this very short version for tonight.

Unlike the normal case where protected articles should not be edited, I want to try an experiment -- admins can edit this article. We need to verify very carefully, with documentable sources, every single fact in the article.
...except that is not the whole story.
He did not only protect the "short" and "critic-free" version: he deleted the whole old article.

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Re: Deleted by Jimbo

Unread post by Poetlister » Fri Nov 01, 2013 11:07 am

The Adversary wrote:He did not only protect the "short" and "critic-free" version: he deleted the whole old article.
That happens if the old article is a real mess. The same thing happened with John Seigenthaler.
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Re: Deleted by Jimbo

Unread post by Hex » Fri Nov 01, 2013 3:24 pm

The Adversary wrote: The logs do not reveal anything.
Engaging Magical Detective Mode...

:sparkles:

:sparkles:

:sparkles:

Ping!

Talk:Alan Dershowitz/old (T-H-L)

The history of the article was selectively moved there (not deleted) by an admin called Brian0918 (T-C-L) (not Jimbo) in December 2005 in a series of delete/undelete actions (see Alan Dershowitz/old (T-H-L)) that he described as "archiving". No links were made to the "archive" from any pages.

Yay... historianship, Wikipedia-style.
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Re: Deleted by Jimbo

Unread post by Tippi Hadron » Fri Nov 15, 2013 6:37 am

From this thread started by the ever entertaining Wnt:
SOPA them. htaccess deny all Safari browsers and iOS devices. Of course the WMF won't do that. Its not an important enough issue like defending Google's right to profit from piracy, counterfeiting, and the selling of chemical abortion drugs without prescription. John lilburne (talk) 07:33, 12 November 2013 (UTC)
Not content with removing the comment ("dishonest trolling", of course), Jimbo thoughtfully storms over to lilburne's talk page to express his appreciation:
Hello, I'm Jimbo Wales. Although everyone is welcome to contribute to Wikipedia, it's important to be mindful of the feelings of your fellow editors, who may be frustrated by certain types of interaction. While you probably didn't intend any offense, please do remember that Wikipedia strives to be an inclusive atmosphere. In light of that, it would be greatly appreciated if you could moderate yourself so as not to offend. Thank you. This edit is a personal attack. Accusing people (me?) of wanting to support criminal activities is disgusting and you should not do it again. Jimbo Wales (talk) 10:53, 12 November 2013 (UTC)
Well played, Mr. lilburne. Next stop ArbCom? :D

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Re: Deleted by Jimbo

Unread post by Vigilant » Fri Nov 15, 2013 6:56 am

Personal attack?!
John didn't mention any editor by name, therefore it cannot be a personal attack. ARBCOM has ruled this in the past.

Perhaps Jimmy need to find the relevant case and request a change at arb clarifications...

Report his happy ass to ANI. I dare you.
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Re: Deleted by Jimbo

Unread post by lilburne » Fri Nov 15, 2013 12:53 pm

Vigilant wrote:Personal attack?!
John didn't mention any editor by name, therefore it cannot be a personal attack. ARBCOM has ruled this in the past.

Perhaps Jimmy need to find the relevant case and request a change at arb clarifications...

Report his happy ass to ANI. I dare you.
You may not be aware by Jimmy takes personal pride in having thought up the SOPA boycott all by himself without input from anyone else and despite Moeller et al having been in discussions about it for at least two weeks before Jimmy took an interest. Its possible that he believes that to be true and that Moeller hypnotized him with one of those stop smoking type tapes:

"SOPA boycott Jimmy, dream about a SOPA boycott Jimmy, a SOPA boycott, SOPA boycott"

Hey guess what chaps I've had a brilliant idea why don't we blackout wikipedia to protest SOPA.
They have been inserting little memes in everybody's mind
So Google's shills can shriek there whenever they're inclined

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Re: Deleted by Jimbo

Unread post by thekohser » Fri Nov 15, 2013 5:05 pm

One must grovel to Jimbo, not address him in a "nasty tone". Or he will delete you!
deleted for nasty tone. Ask again nicely and I'll answer.
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Re: Deleted by Jimbo

Unread post by Mancunium » Fri Nov 15, 2013 5:52 pm

thekohser wrote:One must grovel to Jimbo, not address him in a "nasty tone". Or he will delete you!
deleted for nasty tone. Ask again nicely and I'll answer.
He should be rehearsing his answers for the day he is questioned by a Prosecuting Attorney.
former Living Person

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Re: Deleted by Jimbo

Unread post by thekohser » Fri Nov 15, 2013 8:27 pm

Oh, now it's on like Donkey Kong.
again, I will not answer this until you drop the attitude. I hope others will help me enforce this rather than feeding the troll. -- Jimmy "The Coward" Wales
"...making nonsensical connections and culminating in feigned surprise, since 2006..."

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Re: Deleted by Jimbo

Unread post by thekohser » Fri Nov 15, 2013 8:46 pm

And, of course, a minion is at the ready to make sure even a civilly-worded version cannot be presented.

If anyone is interested in seeing what Jimbo's actual answer would be, if censorship weren't ruling the day, you are free to work from this version, if you'd like:
Jimmy, you have been presented twice with ample evidence that Erlend Bjørtvedt, the vice chairman and treasurer of Wikimedia Norway, who also happens to be a vice president of [[Telenor]], is actively editing Wikipedia articles about his company and subsidiaries of his company. The content of these articles is also being edited by User accounts with names like [[User:Telenor Info]] or [[User:Uninor]], as well as IP addresses that trace to Telenor ISPs. The content they are introducing is atrocious (e.g., "Telenor's mobile commitments in Asia and Eastern and Central Europe are becoming increasingly important and to ensure optimal follow-up, Telenor has appointed dedicated Executive Vice Presidents for these regions. Telenor has also strengthened the co-ordination of operational and human resources across all the countries in which the group has operations through the appointment of two new Executive Vice Presidents to the Group Executive Management."). You have recently sealed with a handshake a deal with Telenor to spread Wikipedia to Burma/Myanmar. Do you have any level of concern about what it does to Wikipedia's reputation to have a vice president of Telenor and agents at his company so earnestly editing Wikipedia to enhance their companies' image, all while you are formally aligning the Wikimedia Foundation and Wikipedia with the very same company? I hope that this has been presented politely, and that you will not erase it for even a third time. Thank you for your time. - ~~~~
Edit: Never mind... Jimbo decided to throw himself a softball, then hit it into a ground-out at first base.
"...making nonsensical connections and culminating in feigned surprise, since 2006..."

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Re: Deleted by Jimbo

Unread post by Vigilant » Fri Nov 15, 2013 9:17 pm

thekohser wrote:And, of course, a minion is at the ready to make sure even a civilly-worded version cannot be presented.

If anyone is interested in seeing what Jimbo's actual answer would be, if censorship weren't ruling the day, you are free to work from this version, if you'd like:
Jimmy, you have been presented twice with ample evidence that Erlend Bjørtvedt, the vice chairman and treasurer of Wikimedia Norway, who also happens to be a vice president of [[Telenor]], is actively editing Wikipedia articles about his company and subsidiaries of his company. The content of these articles is also being edited by User accounts with names like [[User:Telenor Info]] or [[User:Uninor]], as well as IP addresses that trace to Telenor ISPs. The content they are introducing is atrocious (e.g., "Telenor's mobile commitments in Asia and Eastern and Central Europe are becoming increasingly important and to ensure optimal follow-up, Telenor has appointed dedicated Executive Vice Presidents for these regions. Telenor has also strengthened the co-ordination of operational and human resources across all the countries in which the group has operations through the appointment of two new Executive Vice Presidents to the Group Executive Management."). You have recently sealed with a handshake a deal with Telenor to spread Wikipedia to Burma/Myanmar. Do you have any level of concern about what it does to Wikipedia's reputation to have a vice president of Telenor and agents at his company so earnestly editing Wikipedia to enhance their companies' image, all while you are formally aligning the Wikimedia Foundation and Wikipedia with the very same company? I hope that this has been presented politely, and that you will not erase it for even a third time. Thank you for your time. - ~~~~
Edit: Never mind... Jimbo decided to throw himself a softball, then hit it into a ground-out at first base.
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Re: Deleted by Jimbo

Unread post by neved » Fri Nov 15, 2013 11:20 pm

thekohser wrote:And, of course, a minion is at the ready to make sure even a civilly-worded version cannot be presented.

If anyone is interested in seeing what Jimbo's actual answer would be, if censorship weren't ruling the day, you are free to work from this version,
Jimbo himself asked himself a question, and himself answered it, and he did it in a single edit!
http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?tit ... =581816670
Edits by Vice-Chairman of Wikimedia Norway

[Note: Because the anonymous ip seems constitutionally incapable of asking questions in a civil manner (having tried twice and failed miserably) I am going to write the legitimate questions and answers myself, as an illustration of how to do it.)

Hi Jimbo! In my ongoing exploration of the question of conflict of interest edits in Wikipedia, I found some that I thought worthy of calling to your attention, given your strong position on the issue.

What do you think of these edits to the article about Telenor, from June 2013? Of course we know that not every employee of every corporation is going to be familiar with your "Bright Line Rule" that forbids paid advocates from ever directly modifying a Wikipedia article about their own employer or client. However, shouldn't we expect someone who self-identifies as vice chairman of Wikimedia Norway and as Vice President of Telenor Group to be a little more knowledgeable about best practices at Wikipedia? He also created the Wikipedia article Uninor, which is an India-based joint venture of Telenor Group. It seems particularly problematic and potentially embarrassing since the Wikimedia Foundation has formed an alliance with Telenor to bring Wikipedia free to people in the developing world? This edit also strikes me as problematic since it is an article about a competitor of his employer, in a section about a "dispute" between his company and the competitor. I'd love to hear your comments on this matter. - An anonymous user, you can call me "Greg" if you want a nickname for me.

Thanks for calling this to my attention. The creation of the Uninor article seems to have happened in 2009, well before my formulation and promotion of the best practice of "bright line rule", so I think we can forgive that. But the other more recent edits are indeed highly problematic from the perspective of avoiding even the appearance of impropriety. I will immediately send an email expressing my concerns and inviting him to come here and explain, and I will urge him to pledge not to do anything like this again.--Jimbo Wales (talk) 20:26, 15 November 2013 (UTC)
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Re: Deleted by Jimbo

Unread post by thekohser » Sat Nov 16, 2013 12:16 am

neved wrote:Jimbo himself asked himself a question, and himself answered it, and he did it in a single edit!
http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?tit ... =581816670
Yes, and he violated CC-BY-SA requirements to attribute the text that he plagiarized from the original author, making it appear to be his own content. The license require him to "keep intact... the name of the Original Author". He failed to do that, and that's clear cut.

He also "must not distort, mutilate, modify or take other derogatory action in relation to the Work which would be prejudicial to the Original Author's honor or reputation". I suppose that would be a matter for interpretation, but I would personally say that he did distort and modify in a prejudicial manner.

Pretty sad that the "sole founder" of Wikipedia who supposedly helped champion the transition from GFDL to CC-BY-SA doesn't even respect the more lenient terms of the CC-BY-SA license.
"...making nonsensical connections and culminating in feigned surprise, since 2006..."

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Re: Deleted by Jimbo

Unread post by TungstenCarbide » Sat Nov 16, 2013 1:11 am

thekohser wrote:...Pretty sad that the "sole founder" of Wikipedia who supposedly helped champion the transition from GFDL to CC-BY-SA doesn't even respect the more lenient terms of the CC-BY-SA license.
I doubt he even understands them.
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Re: Deleted by Jimbo

Unread post by SB_Johnny » Sat Nov 16, 2013 1:15 am

TungstenCarbide wrote:
thekohser wrote:...Pretty sad that the "sole founder" of Wikipedia who supposedly helped champion the transition from GFDL to CC-BY-SA doesn't even respect the more lenient terms of the CC-BY-SA license.
I doubt he even understands them.
Speaking of which, whatever became of his little war with the commons admins who deleted one of his uploads?
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Re: Deleted by Jimbo

Unread post by TungstenCarbide » Sat Nov 16, 2013 2:04 am

SB_Johnny wrote:
TungstenCarbide wrote:
thekohser wrote:...Pretty sad that the "sole founder" of Wikipedia who supposedly helped champion the transition from GFDL to CC-BY-SA doesn't even respect the more lenient terms of the CC-BY-SA license.
I doubt he even understands them.
Speaking of which, whatever became of his little war with the commons admins who deleted one of his uploads?
You mean the group of British politicians who Jimbo apparently promised to get their preferred portraits installed? Only he didn't understand the copyrights, and when the Commons admins objected Jimbo demanded they "contact [WMF] Legal" before deleting? I think they've been deleted.
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Re: Deleted by Jimbo

Unread post by Poetlister » Sat Nov 16, 2013 2:42 pm

thekohser wrote:He also "must not distort, mutilate, modify or take other derogatory action in relation to the Work which would be prejudicial to the Original Author's honor or reputation".
Does that mean that if someone writes a decent article, and other people come and make nonsense of it, they are violating the copyright? If so, shouldn't the original editor have the right to request deletion? That would be fun.
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