Wikipediocracy

Ross McPherson

Actually Zoloft I don’t need love and Dennis is quite right about one thing – this site increasingly favours the reformists. It will always be that way. They can yabber about Wikipedian personalities and politics until the cows come home, as if that crap matters, whereas the hasten the day mob tends...

Ross McPherson

@ Vigilant The first thing every status quo wants to do, once it is established, is pour cold water on moral outrage. The guys who hijacked the crowd sourced encyclopaedia have been using the fire hose there for years and they would like to use it here too. A nice polite conversation about how best ...

Ross McPherson

I can’t make it Thursday. The spangles take a whole month to polish and the rocket needs new fuel lines. I’m not a professional for God’s sake. I think point is that you are more likely to influence people by engaging them instead of belittling them. It's why I came here: to learn and offer an insi...

Ross McPherson

That’s not knowledge, it’s wallpaper. That's not discussion, it's a trite platitude. Bombastic, too. Do you think, in the future, that you might actually use metaphors, rather than just deploy them as snarky substitutes for actual ideas? I wouldn't hold my breath. Please do. Is the goal to mock inc...

Ross McPherson

That’s not knowledge, it’s wallpaper. That's not discussion, it's a trite platitude. Bombastic, too. Do you think, in the future, that you might actually use metaphors, rather than just deploy them as snarky substitutes for actual ideas? I wouldn't hold my breath. Please do. Is the goal to mock inc...

Ross McPherson

Hex wrote:
Jim wrote:
Ross McPherson wrote:That’s not knowledge, it’s wallpaper.
That's not discussion, it's a trite platitude. Bombastic, too.

Do you think, in the future, that you might actually use metaphors, rather than just deploy them as snarky substitutes for actual ideas?
I wouldn't hold my breath.

Please do.

Ross McPherson

That’s not knowledge, it’s wallpaper. That's not discussion, it's a trite platitude. Bombastic, too. Do you think, in the future, that you might actually use metaphors, rather than just deploy them as snarky substitutes for actual ideas? OK, the idea there is that Wikipedia articles are often just ...

Ross McPherson

The Wildlife News wrote: With all the media, much of it with an agenda, covering this story, finally there is a compilation of facts, and text of court cases on the situation. It is in a new Wikipedia article.

Wikipedia the only factual source? That is a real worry and maybe a sign of future things.

Ross McPherson

@ Zoloft I'll quote her user page for those of us who are too laterally inclined to go there themselves. Hello. My name is Heather Ford and I'm a university fellow at Leeds University in the UK, having recently completed my PhD at the University of Oxford's Oxford Internet Institute (OII). You can f...

Ross McPherson

Generally disappointing. I concur. For the most part, I am amazed that these talks constitute "scholarship" by people holding PhD degrees. I guess we just live in new times, but it seems that these presentations were more the result of "hey, I was fooling around online last night, and look at this ...

Ross McPherson

MysteriousStranger wrote:On a related note, anybody notice a distinct lack of awareness of irony among Wikipedians? So much so that, if you point out irony to them, they'll call you a troll and block you?

A confused environment is no place for irony. Or, to put it another way, an arch look means nothing in a dark lane.

Ross McPherson

Thanks for the links. I looked at all except Hale’s talk. Generally disappointing. About half of them focus on bias as a function of economic/political dominance. I don’t see this as a problem unique to Wikipedia. I grew up in OZ watching tv programs from USA and England and I accept this kind of bi...

Ross McPherson

What Wikipedians think they think and what they actually think are two different things. We know this because we see how selfish they are within the selfless state of Wikipedia. Of course all good things come round and bite themselves on the arse. Thus the nobility of the altruist becomes the ignobi...

Ross McPherson

@ Dennis I ought to call you Dennis Wallpaper Brown. You could even turn the Grand Canyon into a flowery scene, though there is nothing there that needs hiding. If I peel back the corners of your reply, I glimpse the Wikipedia system under words like “attack dog”, “I tend to work in the trenches” an...

Ross McPherson

@ Dennis No it’s not hypocrisy, just tit for tat. Do I want to sift through 2000 of your illustrious cases? One was enough. I have been there and I know how the system under your guidance worked for me. Have the courtesy to admit that authority there is based on expediency and that principles of jus...

Ross McPherson

Did you ask her [/color] about that? I thought that was pretty odd myself. I suppose the logic is that you'd only say that if there were some suggestion that she was an idiot. She? You might want to glance at the 'diff', or this conversation, again (or at all). There's a very subtle gender clue cun...

Ross McPherson

My understanding is that 75% hang left, generally. That would make an interesting 2 bar graph, with axes leanings and percentage of men . I am not sure about the title: Dicks we know ? When I polled the question, I phrased it as "leftists" and "rightists." It was like 28 to 3 to 1 "centrist." I don...

Ross McPherson

thekohser wrote:My understanding is that 75% hang left, generally.

That would make an interesting 2 bar graph, with axes leanings and percentage of men. I am not sure about the title: Dicks we know?

Ross McPherson

@ Kingsindian and Poetlister There are two kinds of bias obviously – undue weight in the choice of articles and undue weight within an article. Bias within an article is rare measured over time because anyone can edit to correct it. Bias in choice of articles is more frequent, I think, because that ...

Ross McPherson

Oh, come now, men can't have correct views about the quantity or quality (or lack thereof) of gender-related content. We're all blind and ignorant prisoners of the dicks flopping around between our legs. Do you hang to the left or the right? I only ask on account of a theory that it correlates to p...

Ross McPherson

Oh, come now, men can't have correct views about the quantity or quality (or lack thereof) of gender-related content. We're all blind and ignorant prisoners of the dicks flopping around between our legs. Do you hang to the left or the right? I only ask on account of a theory that it correlates to p...

Ross McPherson

Man is the hunter, woman the gatherer, and we won’t get through the year without lots of berries and a few mammoths. It’s always mammoth season in Wikipedia and sometimes it’s the colosseum. What you need there is more berries. This is not to deny that there are some Amazons as well as guys with ros...

Ross McPherson

Most of the time, they are indeed blocked for disruption, with only a note of "likely sock of someone", or as a combination of the two. This is a note to reviewing admin as well. Socking is against policy, period, there is a detailed policy on what is socking and what is just an alternate account. ...

Ross McPherson

@ eagle Thanks for the background material. I liked the summary in the Washington Post. ...technology is not enough to keep the Wikimedia movement moving forward. Ultimately, Wikipedia was started by and still relies on the efforts of human volunteers. It will only thrive for another 15 years if tha...

Ross McPherson

The ‘community’ is actually made up of ‘communities’ so small and autonomous they are really just ‘gangs’. Socks are guys in hoodies trying to get about the ‘hood unmolested or maybe whacking rival gangsters. The cops generally end up working with the established gangs because some order is better t...

Ross McPherson

@ Kumioko and Poetlister The only Wikipedians I ever had trouble with, including admins, were certainly adults. Kids can only operate in that environment successfully if they say little. I am not sure people can cause much trouble that way, though they can certainly help it along by shouting with th...

Ross McPherson

I have led a sheltered life: Wikipedia is my only personal experience of corruption and ineptitude on a large scale. It is the developed world masquerading as a developing world, the English speaking nation reconfigured as The Democratic Republic of Mumbo Jumbo. There are a lot of genuinely good peo...

Ross McPherson

@ eagle Well my avatar here is Buster Keaton so I am not just crying. I am also laughing at the whole stupid situation that is Wikipedia. Obviously I am right to protest against the stuff that goes on there. Unfortunately there are only so many times we can say something without repeating ourselves ...

Ross McPherson

@ Eagle Sorry but Wikipedians get no sympathy from me. The WMF did not run me off the road, Wikipedians did. Some jerks dress themselves as cops, link up with road hogs and not only stop people driving, they even piss in their cars to make sure they never come back. Most Wikipedians know this is hap...

Ross McPherson

@ Kelly and Randy Well there we are – generous, free advice, in the nicest traditions of Wikipedia. Thanks. So, reverting to metaphor, WMF owns the roads, contributors drive cars that they have no title over. If I had to decide who should have moral precedence in that setup, I would say it has to be...

Ross McPherson

This is where I somewhat lose the plot. WMF owns Wikipedia, doesn’t it? They can do whatever they like with their own property. The vagrants who have moved in and who have wilfully misunderstood their own importance need a good kick in the butt, or they should show a bit of modesty and get out inste...

Ross McPherson

How about the Byzantine empire. Lots of protocols, and bizarre rituals. A central system disconnected from reality, minor flunkies puffing up their authority and making life difficult for the peasants. All fueled by bribery and corruption. That's way more like it. Wikipedia's "governance" is a fine...

Ross McPherson

Wikipedia Sucks – And So do its Critics Interesting As I understand it, they are angry with Wikipediocracy for allowing in Wikipedia admin-stooges like Dennis Brown and New York Brad. But NYB is one of these guys who says little, apparently on the grounds that he is least likely to make a fool of h...

Ross McPherson

Monkeys don’t own copyright? This is consistent with Wikipedia’s philosophy. The animals there don’t own copyright on their work either. They just keep banging away at their innumerable keyboards for the benefit of humanity.

Ross McPherson

One of the best/worst things about print is the unity it gives to multi-vocal messages. The Tower of Babel doesn’t look confused when the messages come out in uniform text. Moreover any crap, published under a world-wide banner like ‘Wikipedia’, has a uniformly authoritative look. It is designed to ...

Ross McPherson

I suppose there will be better methods to organize "knowledge" in the future, as the internet medium of communication evolves... Interesting point though I am not sure how information is organised without writing. Perhaps you mean videos. That would be great. I would love to see all those anonymous...

Ross McPherson

Good question! Dropping bits of information into a big hole is easy. Organising it is difficult. If you work hard to build an article, and people continue dropping more information into it, it soon begins to look disorganised. That is a major disincentive for doing hard work. Thus more and more Wiki...

Ross McPherson

The more they add, the more incoherent they become and the lower the knowledge sinks. Is this inevitable with an ageing, crowd sourced encyclopaedia? Discuss.

Ross McPherson

It is time to go home. The party is over. Unfortunately it is one of those loud parties you can never escape, even if you are thrown off the premises, because it is in the neighbourhood or global village. I have spent some time throwing stones at Wikipedia’s windows, just to get even, but it hasn’t...

Ross McPherson

Admin FreeRangeFrog disappeared last August, after steadily making 800 edits a month for the last couple of years. Apropos to the discussion here about friendships, his last contributions mostly concern these notices: Notice: Wikipedia is not a social network. You have been indefinitely blocked fro...

Ross McPherson

I don’t mind contributors being friends in a general encyclopaedia, where information takes the form of general knowledge. There is not much spin that can be put on basic facts. But Wikipedia has gone far beyond that. People there won’t let the party end, so they create ever more articles and add ev...

Ross McPherson

Dennis Brown wrote:There is often more to a friendship on Wikipedia than meets the eye, or the pages there.

You have put your finger on the ticking time bomb.

Ross McPherson

@ Dennis and NYB

The cult of virtual friendship is one of Wikipedia’s biggest problems. I know nothing that distorts decisions more than that twaddle.

Ross McPherson

There are three kinds of wikibreaks I tend to see: 1-) People say they'll be away so their collaborative wikifriends know. 2-) People want to be dramatic and point out they are mad about something. They usually come back in a short time . 3-) People just stop editing with no reason why. I highly re...

Ross McPherson

Wikmedia blog: ...he won his colleagues over by showing them the peer-reviewed aspects of Wikipedia, like the Good Article and Featured Article processes. And he contributed to articles particularly useful to Auburn University Montgomery, including the article on the school and a biography of a col...

Ross McPherson

Many people do more socializing than editing or meta, which I think clogs up the system and is a detriment to the project. I forgot about these Wikipedians. Yes these Wikipedians probably enjoy themselves. I doubt they think in terms of wikibreaks. I should now redefine Wikipedians - there are sad ...

Ross McPherson

This may explain your problem. It is you like going to a carnival but having a really bad time, so you assume everyone else must be having a bad time because you list all the bad things at the carnival, so everyone is either lying, a fool, or having a bad time. Your hatred of the place masks what i...

Ross McPherson

So, to follow up my previous argument, the only Wikipedians who can get real value from their work (apart from professonal writers) are those who enjoy it. That introduces the question – do any Wikipedians really enjoy their work at Wikipedia? This implies ownership ( their work) but Wikipedians are...

Ross McPherson

I volunteered to get something on my resume. I still volunteer when I can when my part-time job allows it. Volunteering has its ups and downs like any job. The lack of pay or benefits while dealing with the aggravation associated with the position is clear down. “I spent a number of years editing W...

Ross McPherson

People talk about volunteering being fun - but there are other reasons people volunteer (thats a difference between a hobby and a volunteer role)... I'd consider editting Wikipedia worthwhile, depending on what you do there... Worthwhile? OK let’s list the values we get from contributing to Wikiped...

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